Matewan Oral History Project Collection
Sc2003-135

Richard Brewer Interview

Becky Bailey: This is Rebecca Bailey for the Matewan Development Center, ten o'clock, Monday morning, July 17th, 1989. I'm at the home of Reverend Richard Brewer, Church of God minister. Near Varney, West Virginia.

B: Okay. Alrighty.

Richard Brewer: This is my grand...

B: Well brother Brewer my first question is when you were born and where?

RB: I was born in 19 and...I was born in 1918 uh...this next house down here. It was an old log house at that time. And I was born in this holler here.

B: And so we'll have it on tape what do you call this holler here?

RB: Spice Branch.

B: Spice Branch. Okay. And what were your parents names?

RB: Uh...Jessie Brewer and Mary Brewer.

B: Were they natives of this area or had they come here from somewhere else?

RB: Uh...my mother was but my dad came from Wayne County.

B: Do you know what brought him to this area?

RB: No I don't.

B: Okay. What was your mother's maiden name?

RB: Uh...Mary Alice Tiller.

B: Taylor was her last name?

RB: Tiller uh-huh. T.I.L.L.E.R.

B: Okay. What did your father do for a living? Was he a miner?

RB: He was a coal miner.

B: What company did he work for? Do you know?

RB: Red Jacket Coal Company most of the time.

B: Okay. How many brothers and sisters did you have?

RB: I had uh...three brothers...two brothers. I got a half brother which makes three brothers. I had two brothers. Didn't have no sisters. We got...I got some adopted sisters.

B: Do you know, did your mother have a doctor come to help her with the babies when they were born or did she have...

RB: No had a mid-wife.

B: She did...do you know who the mid-wife was?

RB: Uh...Aunt Dory Harmon. Is what we called her. Aunt Dory Harmon she was the mid-wife in this...she was the mid-wife in this county for many years.

B: How much would she charge to help a woman...

RB: Nothin'.

B: With a baby...nothing...she just came.

RB: She was just...did it freely. I never knowed her chargin' anyone you know. She's just uh...seemed like that was her job she'd do. And where that lady needed help why she was there.

B: Okay.

RB: Use to be people would help one another this day and time they don't do anything but it's for pay.

B: That's true. That's very true. Do you know how long she would stay? Would she just stay long enough for the baby to be born?

RB: Well they'd usually tell her about the time uh...in fact most of the women knew about the time you know. So she'd come and stay 'til the time and then she'd go back home. Maybe a day or two.

B: Did your mother ever tell you where your father was when you all were born? Was he...did he stay around or was he working?

RB: No, she never did tell us. Never was interested, never did ask.

B: Okay. I notice you were born in 1918. Did any of your family fight in World War I? Did any of your fathers people or...

RB: No...

B: ...mothers people?

RB: No.

B: Okay.

RB: My brother was in uh...1942 war.

B: He was?

RB: Yeah. My youngest brother he's dead now.

B: How long did you all go to school?

RB: Uh...I went to eighth grade...fer as I went. See we didn't have no way of transportation a getting to...Red Jacket was the only high school they had at that time. And uh...see we walked to school from here uh...it's two miles to school. I was two miles back, but we walked it. I got a perfect attendance record for walking everyday and never missing a day.

B: Two miles each day everyday?

RB: Uh-huh.

B: Oh goodness.

RB: Yeah.

B: What was the name of the school that you went to?

RB: Varney Grade School.

B: Varney Grade School. What do you remember about your school days as a child? Anything in particular stand out in your mind?

RB: Well to me it was a real good school, but we only had one room, one teacher and they taught from what we call the primer to the eighth. And uh...just one teacher taught the whole bunch of us. And uh...during the time when you got to where you could read and write why they...the way they helped you to learn to read and write, they'd put you with somebody else that could and they'd teach you. And when you got up so far in that class uh...they would have uh...questions and answers, and they'd put the young ones aginst the old ones. And he said how they would study to try to out do that older person you know. Other words they'd put the second grade aginst the third. Third aginst the fourth, fourth grade aginst the fifth right on up that way. And seemed like they all took an interest because everybody wanted to beat the other person. And they learnt...seemed to me like they learned a better that way. And back them days if you done wrong they whipped you with a switch.

B: They did?

RB: Yeah. They didn't whip you with a belt or anything. For a long time there they used switches. They'd go out and cut a switch off of a bush and just wear you out with it. But children was better. Children was better when they whipped them.

B: Did you all have men teachers or women teachers?

RB: First two or three teachers I went to was women teachers and the last was men that...when I went to the eighth grade they'd built the big school at Varney. And uh...I went to them a feller by the name of Mayshack Browning was my principal. Uh...he was one principal and uh...lets see I forget what that other principals name was. He's Candy(?) Judge Candy was principal. Him and May-shack(?) was our principals.

B: How long during the year did you all go to school?

RB: We went eight months.

B: Eight months?

RB: I believe that's what we went eight months. I'm pretty sure it was.

B: How long was your school day? Lets see you had to walk two miles so you were probably pretty early.

RB: Well they started at nine and quit at three. And we had a morning recess and noon hour and then at two thirty they let us out for fifteen minutes.

B: What kind of games did ya'll play when ya'll were little at the school house?

RB: Ball mostly ball. And they football they call it but nearly kill it jump to play football then...it would kill ya. We didn't have nothing but rocks to play in you know. No level ground or anything. Baseball was the...was the best game we had. Well we didn't have no facility stuff to play anything else you know. We just had to play and sometime we made our own balls because we didn't have none.

B: What'd ya make them out of?

RB: Uh...yarn. Cloth or rag or yarn uh...weaving we'd roll it around and around and make a ball out of it and then sew it in there. It made pretty good balls.

B: I guess...did you all ever have marbles? Did any of you all ever have marbles?

RB: Yeah...yeah we had marbles. That was a good game.

B: Did you all pack your lunches or did they have a lunch there for you?

RB: We had to pack it. What we'd eat we'd pack. And about all we had you see and we didn't even have light bread they'd bake biscuits and uh...we'd pack our lunch in a little brown bag or a little what we call four pound lard bucket. And uh...they would uh...my mom see would fry what you call bean cakes. She'd cook beans and then she'd take the beans after we'd eat from them and she'd mash them up make bean cakes out of them. Our potatoes the same way and uh...and we had our own cattle so we had milk and butter we'd take us a little jar of milk and butter and sandwich or maybe butter and jelly sandwich and maybe them bean cakes and things. That's what we had for lunch. We didn't have no...no lunch at all 'til the last year that I went to school...the eight grade.

B: Is that when you started carrying it or was that when they started...

RB: That's what they...we carried it form the day we started school. That's the only way we had any lunch at dinner, it's too far to go home so we'd uh...pack a little lunch. What ever we wanted. What ever mommy would fix us.

B: About how many big was your school? How many people went to it when you went to it?

RB: Oh about between 15 to 25. I don't think they'd been over 25 of us in no time. But we had a wonderful time.

B: How did you all celebrate holidays back then? Did you all celebrate Christmas in your family?

RB: In the family we did but not in the school. All that you know we would put up maybe little things that help us cut little things out of paper. We didn't have nothing else. Family why we get a little something other from Christmas. Hardly ever got much you know cause we didn't have nothing to get with.

B: So how long did you all have off for Christmas at school? Did you all take...

RB: I really don't remember. That's been a long time ago.

B: Okay. How about the fourth of July? It seems like that use to be a bigger holiday many years ago than it is now.

RB: Well the biggest thing that we would be off on the fourth of July, the biggest thing that we had at one time here was a airport down here at uh...what we call Airport Bottom where that school is down there now. Back over...there use to be a airport and Frank Allara was the pilot and uh...we'd go down there every now and then and it we got enough money we'd ride that plane and they'd have some fireworks and things. That was one of the biggest days of the whole year except Christmas.

B: Did you ever get to ride in that airplane?

RB: Yeah um-hum.

B: What did you think of that? What did you think about riding in that airplane?

RB: Well it was a great thrill but it was a little plane see and when it hit a air pocket it felt like it was falling out from under you. And I'd grab the seat and hold it. And he didn't' take us very high. We'd look down at the ground and see the houses and things real good.

B: Um...mercy.

RB: He only charged five dollars to take us up and take us around over Delbarton I believe he took us over Matewan I'm not sure. Just a little trip but oh it was a real thrill to ride that plane.

B: Okay. Did your mother uh...make ya'lls clothes or did she make...

RB: Yeah she made most of our clothes.

B: Did she get the material and things out of the company store?

RB: Yeah uh...sometimes out of the company store and then a lot of times, back then they had these feed sacks you know and uh...she would make us shirts out of them feed sacks. They was uh...spotted and so on stripped and pretty little shirts. My mom could really sew. (someone calls to him)) Excuse me. Yes honey (tape cuts off)

B: What do you remember about going to the company store as a child? Did ya'll...did they let ya'll go with them when they...

RB: Yeah uh...when I got up to be a pretty good boy I went to the store for them all the time. And we walked see. We lived up the holler here in a log house on up the holler. And uh...they'd send me to the store and I'd take uh...I called a coffee sack, a feed sack you know. And uh...I'd go to the store and buy the stuff back through the mountain and to the house. I knowed the way backard and forward through the mountain. And that's the way we got out groceries I packed them home..

B: What kind of things did ya'll buy up at the store?

RB: Well it was uh...mostly flour and lard most...some...most.. very seldom was ever lard because we raised out own hogs and just about had to have...but salt and flour and sugar beans something like that you know. Something other we could...bacon if we bought bacon it was only ten cents a pound. I believe we paid .48 cents a bag for a 24 pound bag of flour. So everything was real cheap you know.

B: Did ya'll have a garden? Did ya'll raise your own...

RB: Yeah uh. We raise a garden we raised...we raised a good field of corn and beans and we would take and take them beans and me and my older brother would uh...we would uh...peddle them beans over in Red Jacket and corn. Sold the beans for .50 cents a peck and the corn fer .50 cents a dozen. Now they'd want a dollar a yer (ear) for it.

B: I've heard my mother use that expression peck. How big is that? Can you...about how big is, it's hard to describe?

RB: A peck, have you saw these large water buckets?

B: Yes sir.

RB: Now they hold exactly a peck.

B: Okay. Say you all lived in a log house?

RB: Yes mam, dobbed with mud.

B: Did your father build that house or...

RB: Yes mam uh-huh. My father and my brothers. We had what they called a log raising. He cut the logs and brought them in then a whole gang of the neighbors come in and help us put the logs up and he finished the top and everything. And uh...rive boards, we cut trees...uh oak trees, and rive boards to put the top on the house. Didn't have no roofing so we just rive boards and nailed them on. It didn't have a leak. Made paling out of those uh...things you know put a slat...you saw these paling slats stick up with the sharp ends on them. And we use to rive them out of trees here.

B: Alright um...lets see, what kind of flooring did ya'll have in the house?

RB: Just great big old wide boards. Usually a poplar flooring and uh...the way we cleaned it, was we'd get some sand and put on it. Then mom would put lie in that sand then we'd...this branch used to run big all the time you had plenty of water we'd pack that water in there and uh...throw that water on that and she's sweep it out. And the floor had little cracks in it you know it'd go down through the cracks and things. Was hard...make it just as white you know when she got done with it.

B: How many room did you all have?

RB: Three.

B: Three.

RB: Four all together four. That's counting...didn't count the back room. Had four rooms and a kitchen, dinning [sic] room, and two bed rooms.

B: Where did you all get your furniture back then? Did your father make it?

RB: Made most of it huh-uh. Made tables, chairs. My dad could whittle about anything nearly. He used a knife and he whittled and made these own chairs and he'd make the back out of a sugar tree and uh...postage he'd make them out of hickory and then he'd take hickory bark and run across the bottom and made bottom and it'd last for many years.

B: Did he ever explain to you why he picked hickory for the bottom and...

RB: Oh yeah.

B: How come?

RB: Yeah well the hickory bark see uh...this time of the year right now you could take a hickory and it feels good. Take big long strips of it and cut it in little fine strips and that outer bark will come off of it. And it just leaves the soft bark. And when it dries it's just as hard as uh...hard as a rock nearly. And he'd run it lacid on that chair and when it dried it just tightened up itself. And uh...the hickory post is like that...the sugar tree, he'd use sugar tree posts and he cut it green and he used hickory rounds whittled them out. He had an auger and he bore a hole in that and he put them rounds in there. He never put a nail in it and as quick as that sugar tree would dry why you couldn't have pulled it apart. Just...see you'd already have the hickory dried you know. So hit wasn't doing away but...and that there sugar tree was just hold it...that's why he used it cause it'd dry and couple up on those things so good.

B: Did he teach any...you or your brothers to do that kind of thing or did you all just...

RB: Well we could do it but we never would try cause he did it all.

B: Uh-huh. How long did your father work in the mines. I'm not sure now how long he worked but no doubt, I'm almost positive he worked at 50 some years in the mines, cause that's all he ever done all his life was mining you know. Except he worked a little in the timber when he didn't' have no job in the mines. His main job was mining.

B: Did he join the union? Do you know how he felt...

RB: Oh yeah. When it come in. See we didn't have no union 'til in the thirties.

B: Um-hum. How about you, when did you start working after you left school? What did you do?

RB: I started working the year that I was 18 I started in the coal mines. Loading coal.

B: When did you finish uh...your school and how old were you then?

RB: I'm not sure. I'm really not sure. I'd only be a guessing if I told you but I'm not sure when I finished...but when I finished why I couldn't go to high school cause it wasn't none to go to. No way to go and uh...so I worked for people up and down the creek here 'til I was 18 I hoed corn fifty cents a day. And I also worked on a saw mill right here where I live here, fifty cents a day.

B: What'd you do at the saw mill?

RB: I helped packed the lumber off you know and haul it off bare. And they'd uh...I was small so they'd give me somebody to help me. And took two of us to pack one board sometime. I saw both come out of here that was at least three to four foot wide. And it was uh... oh they weighted...they'd weigh an awful lot. Especially chest nut. See uh...when I was little we had plenty of chest nut trees but now the chest nut trees is all dead you know. We don't have nothing but these...I call them Chinese chest nuts you know them old big ones. We had chest nuts trees that would go five or six foot through.

B: Yeah. Were they the most valuable trees for lumber or...

RB: They were valuable for lumber and uh...they...they were good for...those nuts was good they didn't get warmed in like they used to you know. And they's good you had plenty agin and you see they ...them chest nuts never got killed out cause they only bloom in June see so all the cold weather's gone. And by September they drop their nuts you know and we had plenty of game squirrels and everything and we had plenty to eat you know of course them chest nuts never...never...failed the fire.(?) See our other trees now uh...like hickories and oak and things they won't bare right now a lot of the time because the frost kills them. That's why the chesenuts to me was one of the most valuable trees in the forrest [sic].

B: Cause of when they bore their nuts and everything?

RB: Yeah um-hum. See about anything eat those nuts see, squirrels and ground hogs, and coons and all these, those animals would eat them. And deer what deer we had. We finally killed all the deer out. But they loved them nuts too you know.

B: What kind of game did you all hunt back then?

RB: We hunted squirrel, rabbit, coon, possum, ground hog, fox. My...my grandpa was a fox hunter, he hunted fox.

B: Really?

RB: Yeah but he never killed 'em. He just run his dog. I seen these dogs run as high as three days and come in with such sore feet it'd take nearly a week before they could walk again. And he wouldn't kill foxes. Like to hear his dog run.

B: How about possums, did you all kill the possums?

RB: Uh-huh. He killed them skinned them and sold their hide. We'd get sometimes .20, or .30 cents apiece for a hide. Well it might not have been much today wouldn't have been much but back then if you got five or six dollars it was worth a hundred dollars today.

B: That's true. Who would uh...ya'll sell the hides to? Who bought them?

RB: We sent them off to Sears Roebuck and uh...Tising Ginseng Company. Roebucks was who...Roebucks was the main person. Sears Roebuck do always.

B: And who was the other place that you all...

RB: Tising...Tising...T.I.S.I.N.G. Ginseng Company. They'd take first to. But Roebucks give the best price on it. And that's where we sent...where we'd get the best price.

B: If you all sent them in would they send you money back? RB: Uh-huh. Yeah they'd send us a check you know. And that was good. Cause they'd itemized...how much each hide was worth. If it was worth .30 cents, .20 cents, .15 you was lucky to get more than .60. Had to be extra good but you know that wasn't much but it was something other and a fox hide we could get out of a fox hide...we'd get two to three dollars. So made a killing when you got a few fox hides.

B: What all...what were the different hide you would send in? Possum and fox?

RB: Possum. We could send possum and fox and pole cat.

B: Now what's that?

RB: That's what you call a skunk.

B: Oh...how much did you all get for those?

RB: Sometimes a dollar. Cause if you got one with the stripes on him that's real beautiful you know large one he'd bring you a dollar. Sometimes I guess it's worth the smell.

B: Now you say you went to work in the mines when you were eighteen?

RB: Yes mam.

B: Now you...was it Red Jacket that you...

RB: Red Jacket Coal Company.

B: How'd you get hired? Can you remember how you got your job? RB: Well uh...my dad knew the superintendent and he worked there you see. And he told me that summer...I wanted him to get me a job and he said "I'll tell you what I can do if you'll stay home and hoe our corn out and get corn laid buy, yeah you lay the corn by I'll get you a job". I said "okay." So I stayed home and hoed the fields of corn out there send some people up and down the creek that I worked for. And I got it all done I told dad "well now I've got it all done now", so he took me over there and they give me a job. Loading coal. I got .32 cents a ton for it.

B: So when...so we'll have it on tape explain how somebody would load coal. Was that coal that somebody else had picked out or uh..

RB: No uh...you went inside and it was shot out see, and they brought a car in and you'd take a shovel. And I have worked in coal so low that I could put my fist over top of the cart. See where it was big enough for me to get my coal in there. And sometimes you'd have to bust some of that coal up before you could throw it in the car. And we only made...we only made three...two or three dollars a day. During the run of the month you was lucky if you made thirty dollars. And I work on a motor for a dollar and a half a day. Up until we got a union established we didn't have.. ..we didn't get nothing hardly. That's why these fellers are fighting so hard for the union now. We had such a time back then a getting it. And now...you'd work in water... they didn't care how deep that water was...it was up to your knees...you either worked in it or went to the house. And that meant your job. So you know you worked...we worked. There was no such thing as coming out of that mines dry. If you had a place or water...they didn't have no pumps then to pump it out with. And we'd load our coal and we'd hear the motor coming to get the car...and you'd take your shovel and you'd throw all the water in that car you could get in there. While that motor was coming he'd pull it out and set you another one in. It was the same way...time the evening come you just pretty well have it dried up.

B: Did you get more money for working in water or...

RB: No didn't...didn't get no more if you'd been in a dry place. They didn't pay you no more money for nothing.

B: How about ventilation? Did you all have ventilation...at that time.

RB: Very little...very little sometime you could go in and it's kindly hard to explain but they had shot the place and you could see the smoke, have you ever been in an air plane and seen the clouds?

B: Um-hum.

RB: You look down under you and there the cloud...that's the way that smoke was in the mines. It just land right on the bottom and a lot of times you'd take you shovel and you'd fan it. Get stirred up and that's about the only air we'd have.

B: In the mines?

RB: Yeah uh...I was talking about the smoke...when they...after they'd shoot it you go in the morning to load the coal and that smoke was laying on the bottom it just looked like you being in an airplane looking down at the cloud, and boy we'd get the most of it out we would take our shovel and fan it towards the mouth of the entry. (entrance) And when that motor run up in there why he'd pull some of it out And uh...sometimes you'd get down on that smoke. I mean it'd get you 'til you couldn't walk and uh...you'd get back to where you'd crawl back to a place and rest and a lot of time it'd give you a head ache. Or they called a sick headache, you'd vomit. That didn't happen to often but sometimes that would happen like that. It was according how long the shooting crew see shot. And if they got to your place last you was the one that got the smoke. Cause if...the first ones would shoot the smoke would pretty well be dead out on it see. But them last ones if you was one of the last ones that got your place shot then you had an awful lot of smoke in there.

B: How did they decide who got what place when they would shoot out a place...

RB: Well they gave you...each one gave you a place. You had your own place to work in. And you timbered it your own self, you cleaned it up and uh...they had a track crew that laid the track and they'd leave what we call jumpers. That's little pieces of steel about eight to ten feet and as you would shovel out the coal in front what we'd try to do is go in and shovel the front out. Right as the track was. We'd take them little jumpers and lay them on and when they shoved the coal up all we had to do is just put the coal over in the car because we'd shove it agin the face we would try to make us a hole straight in the middle throw the coal back beside of it cause we wasn't wanting to have such time a loading it. And it made it easy. You learn how to do them things when you...

B: Working...

RB: Have to work like that.

B: Did you all get spent...I mean did you all get paid for the time you spent uh...putting the timbers in?

RB: Oh no. No you only got paid for the time you loaded it. The tons you loaded the coal. It didn't matter if it took you all day to load a ton you just got paid for .32 cents for that ton of coal.

B: Um...Did you all ever have any of the I.W.W's organizers? Did you ever hear about any I.W.W. organizers?

RB: No hunt-uh...it was UMW. All of our organizers was UMW.

B: Okay.

RB: United Mine Workers.

B: Did you all have local organizers or outside...

RB: Just local...local mostly.

B: Who were some of the organizers that you remember?

RB: Uh...a feller by the name of Charlie Isaac was one big organizer was in our county. And I forget that other mans name it's been so long, but they were...they were two of them that was main men over it. And Charlie Isaac was one of them. But I don't remember the other mans name.

B: Does the name Charlie Kiser ring a bell?

RB: Charlie Kiser that's who it was Charlie Kiser. Charlie Kiser lived over on uh...head of Mate Creek over there. That was him.

B: What do you remember about him?

RB: He was just uh...seemed to me like a good man and he done his best for the men. He tried to fight for the men all the time you know. Tried to get them something other and he would try to get the mines organized so the men would get more. For you know we had a time course I wasn't in on all that. I got in about the time they just about got it in see. And when I went to work in the mines we had to wear cloth cap, cloth shoes, carbide lamps, we didn't have no such things like electric light like they got now. We had a carbide light. And we had to furnish our own carbide. What ever you used in there. Even down uh...if you had a shovel you bought that shovel. That was your, ax, pick, bar, auger, what ever we used we had to buy it out of our own pocket. And the company didn't give us nothing for that. We used our own tools. and they had uh...a thing going you either could bring your tools, bring the cutter, bring the tools in other words if you didn't load that cut out that day you might as well load your tools up cause they they're gonna fire you. That's why the feller fight so hard today for the union. There's still some old people around knows what happened to them.

B: How much would you say that your equipment would costs you out of what you made?

RB: Well lets see now. After you bought a shovel it would last your for a year and the pick would last you almost a life time. So would the bar, ax would last a long time. I'd say the whole thing wouldn't cost you over six...seven dollars. But in that day and time six or seven dollars was worth seventy-five or eight today maybe more.

B: Yeah.

RB: I got a (unintelligable) shovel out there I paid five dollars and something for. Use to be if you paid two dollars for a shovel you was paying big you know.

B: What was a bar?

RB: That was what they call slate bar. It's a big long bar with a crook on one end and uh...flat place on the other and what you used for in case a piece of slate was about to come down you'd back up from it and it was about four to five foot long and you'd put it over top of you and pull that slate down to keep it from falling on you. And then you'd take a hammer and bust it up and you didn't get nothing of that either they'd throwed it over to the side. And an ax we had to...if the timber was too long we had to keep a good sharp ax...if the timber was to long you had to down it and cut it off to set it. And most of them that's what you done to 'til about practically all the timbers cut them off. Never got them the right length.

B: Was there any ever any accidents where you worked?

RB: Oh yeah. What got most of anything was breakmens getting killed. see that was uh...see it's hard to explain to someone how the thing was in that day because they, what we call gob that was slate and coal everything come right down to the...come right down to the track. There were no place to get off. And that breakman rode the back of the car. He used a whistle, and sometime you'd have maybe seventeen and eighteen car. And the motor man never heard you never seen you and if you happened to miss a switch they didn't have no throws, you jerked it with your hand or kicked it with your foot well if you missed one of them things and your foot got caught now the cars you's dead.

B: Would it drag you underneath of it...

RB: Oh yeah it'd run right over top of you. The only thing that that motor man could hear or see was your whistle. He heard your whistle and you had so many whistle one was to stop. One loud whistle two was to get off and three whistles mean come on back. So that's the way you did it.

B: Now did you work in...were these straight in mines? Did you go straight in or were they shaft mines.

RB: No they straight.

B: Straight...what did you all call them were they drift mines or shaft...

RB: Drift mines. Drift mines uh-huh the other one they call them shaft mines. Back then they didn't' have no strip jobs they didn't have nothing to strip with.

B: Now did you all have to walk...how far back in did you ever go? Do you know was there ever any...did you go in very deep?

RB: Oh yeah but we didn't walk we rode what they call the mantrip. the motor took us into the mouth of the section and you walked to your place. I'd say it most we ever had to walk would been uh... close to a quarter of a mile. You know yeah they back miles and uh...but they'd hauled you in and hauled you out.

B: About how long would that ride take?

RB: Sometimes ten to fifteen minutes sometimes a half an hour. Just accordin' to how the distance you know you had to go.

B: Yeah what about uh...you say you had to wear cloth shoes. To when you went in...

RB: Yeah we could have wore any kind but that's the only kind they had in them days. Cloth it didn't matter if it was tennis shoes just as long as you had shoes on. But was the only kind they had in them days. Cloth. It didn't matter just as long as you had a shoe on. See then you finally got the hard hat. The hard hat come out first. And uh...then they had uh...hard toed shoes and they forced us to wear both of them the company did see they's safety. Which after we wore them a little while we a fought them before we'd given them up. They was so valuable you know. But we bucked even on that we didn't want to wear them acted like we didn't. But Lord God saved your head a many a time from bumping it. B: What about...I've heard...now this may have been way before your time but how about when they had gas? When they'd have a you know methane or something in the uh...mines?

RB: Well now I've never seen them do it but we had some gas but what they'd did back then was take their carbide lamps and....you know their pockets in the top and they'd put that carbide lamp in that pocket and burn that gas out of there. Which they never had enough gas then. They didn't' advance enough then you know for stuff like that to bother 'em but today they advance you hit a gas pocket now and you run into the end of it for a little while cause I've worked in the mines....I've worked up here at Wes Marling(?) where we had uh...12,000 feet of gas going right...uh...air going in the face and hit just about blow a drill bit. Like out of the holly so much gas. Sometime you have to shut the mines down for half an hour maybe an hour to get the gas out. Just cut it and it come out.

B: How they'd get it out? How would they get it out?

RB: With uh...air.

B: Okay.

RB: Back then they didn't' have that much. Red Jacket never did have no gas in these that I know of, and I worked there many years.

B: You say you worked about thirty years?

RB: Yes mam. I worked for Red Jacket and I worked for Lando Coal Company. Where you mines Puritan. last work I did for...was for Omar Mining Company at Stirrat. (WV)

B: Which do you say was about the best company to work for? I've heard some people say that some people like Red Jacket...

RB: Well uh...surely who the best company that I worked for in my life was Red Jacket.

B: Really?

RB: Yeah the rest of them was hard people to work for.

B: What made Red Jacket better to work for?

RB: I guess cause we knowed everybody. You know and uh...bosses all knowed everybody so they was good to us. You go to a strange mines and uh...it's a lot different cause they don't know you and up until they learn you why they'll make a little hard on you.

B: I interviewed uh...one man that worked around here and he said his uncle belonged to uh...group of mines called the wild catters and they'd...they'd go and if a boss wasn't being good to his men they'd talk to him or beat him up or something. Did you ever hear about that?

RB: Well now that just happened in them strikes.

B: Oh Okay.

RB: What they called a wild cat strike these peoples doing to day use to be they would go right up on the hill and they'd take that superintendent or mine foreman and whip 'em.

B: Oh...

RB: Yes mam they really got mean with them and...

B: So this happened years ago?

RB: Yeah um-hum years ago...many years.

B: But it was when they'd be a strike or something going on?

RB: Yeah during the strike. They didn't bother nobody 'til while there was no strike on it was a strike...and when they formed a picket line like they do you better not go over that picket line. I mean if you went over that picket line you just risked your life cause them feller would hurt you. See today they got the law sitting there blocking them. It'd be like that today there wouldn't be no strikes like they had if it was back that. But today there's polices sitting there see.

B: So the police didn't come years ago?

RB: No never did see a police.

B: Years ago were you ever involved in any strikes?

RB: No. We had strikes but I stayed at the house I didn't picket. See I've been a preacher about all that time.

B: Oh Okay.

RB: and I didn't believe in violence so I just didn't go out and...and fool with it. Then I bosses the last uh...16 years I worked in the mines I bossed. I was mine foreman I made number one mine foreman papers and I bossed. B: How did...how did you get your uh...foreman papers?

RB: Uh...well you had to work five years before you was eligible then you go to Charleston and take a test, and I went to Charleston and took the test for that mine foreman papers I made number one papers. And that way I'd give me uh...a chance to boss in any of these mines. I made papers that was good for fire bossing or anything that was to do in the mines my papers was that good. They... back then see you have to go for different thing. But back then when you went and got number one papers you could do anything there was to do.

B: And what did you work at different things after that or did you stay with one thing...

RB: I stayed mostly uh...well just like if a mine shut down I'd go to another mines see and I ask them about a job and they said they didn't have nobody I had to tell them but I'd say well I got mine foreman papers, I got number one papers they'd say well we'd give you something other 'til we get a place open. And they'd give me just doing something other anything to keep me there cause they always needed foreman. And quick as they got an opening why then I'd take that place. So it was no job at all for me to get a job I...anything time I don't know as I ever walked up to a mines in my life that I didn't get a job at. Whether they need me or not they'd a hire me just cause I had the papers you know.

B: How come them to lose so many foreman?

RB: Uh...foreman job's a hard job. A lot of people don't realize that a foreman job is very hard. And uh...the company picks on the boss and the men does to. And you got to try to please both of them so I could always get a long with men real good and by getting along with the men I did run plenty of coal. I run usually beat anything on the job running coal. Well by doing that I was in with the men and the boss and the main ups too so I just had to run the thing.

B: What did you do that was different you think that was better?

RB: Well i was good to the men. I was real good and uh...one thing I never would as if you was working for me I will never ask you to do something other that I wouldn't do. Or I wouldn't ask you to go in a place that I wouldn't go. See a lot of the other bosses they'd want men to do something that they wouldn't dirty their hands with. Or they'd try to run them in a bad place. If I thought a place was bad I'd tell them right quick no don't go in there it's dangerous. Don't go in I wouldn't go in. And I'd tell them not to 'til we fixed it up. And I seed that it was safe before I sent them in there. So they seen that I was looking out for them. And uh..that was they working for me. Usually if your good to me I'll be good to you.

B: Right.

RB: I had them to change me to section to section cause I was a good hand to pick up and run coal on them sections. The coal was down they'd send me to that section that was down. And i had my men to say preacher if you don't want to go we'll strike. I said no boys that's my job. And I never went to a section that I didn't pick up the coal in it. So uh...I had a good record.

B: Is that what they called you preacher?

RB: Uh-huh yeah....yeah they all called me preacher everywhere I went. And that's how I lost my job.

B: How come?

RB: Preaching funerals. They though they was gonna scare me.

B: So you say the company didn't want you to preach for peoples funerals?

RB: Well I preached a lot of funerals see and uh...they called me in the office and told me either stop preaching funerals like that or they'd have to let me go. And I just told them you just go ahead and let your mine get happy and your pencils start shouting I'm ready to leave here. I preached a couple more and they fired me. But now they did...they really did in about two weeks they called me back...I went to the super and talked to him and he told me I'm sorry what you done...what I've done to you he said you come back and you can pick out any place you want to on this job and you can have it. I said "no I don't never intend to work no more", so I just quit. Then on but they did offer me my job back. And offered me the pick of the...pick of the mines.

B: Do you know what it was about the fact that you were preaching funerals that bothered them? Did they explain? What was it?

RB: Well yes uh...they had their reason but I had mine. I was on a salary and like you would be a working as my buddy I'd say now I'll be off tomorrow I preach a funeral tomorrow you take my place tomorrow night. Tomorrow and anything time you want to lay off you tell me and I'll double back in your place. Well I did that well when I laid off see they lost a lot of coal. They didn't run near the coal that I run while I was their and they said they was losing to much coal. I said "I'm not losing no time", I said "I make up everyday that I lay off", and I was. But they thought...what they thought they'd do would scare me you know. But after I got out I said, "ah I just quit". So the church takes care of me.

B: Okay. Well I guess getting back to that subject I'll ask you first were you raised in uh...in a religion? What religion were you?

RB: Yeah um-hum. Church of God.

B: How far back did your parents belong to that church? Was that something that their parents belonged to? Or do you know when it got started....

RB: Yeah my mother did now my did didn't but my mother belonged to it way back fer as I know. First thing she was I reckon was uh...a Freewill Baptists. Then she got the Holy Ghost and the Church of God came in this country the Cleveland Tennessee Church of God and she joined that and she was a member of it then. And when I got started that's what I got to praying in and I took fellowship with them see. And after took fellowship with them why they didn't have enough members to take care of the pastor so they called it disbanning the church. And they come and took the book and then they...people gathered around and anointed me with oil and put me in as pastor. And I called myself a free pastor...and now see our church is The Church of God. Heading is The Church of God no book but the Bible. And that means we don't have no rules no government and no discipline but the Bible. Now the Cleveland Tennessee Church they've got uh...headquarters in Tennessee. Our headquarter is in Heaven.

B: Okay.

RB: And we don't feel like I can turn a man out of the church or I can't put him in but they do you see.

B: Okay.

RB: We preach that every child of God regardless of denomination you're in...regardless with your affiliation with any church. If you're a real child of God your born again your in the same church we're in. Because God put you in the church. The Bible says, "the Lord adds to the church daily such as should be saved". So if he's gonna add you how in the world...why do I got any business puttin' you out.

B: Right.

RB: So I couldn't turn you out no how. It's up to him.

B: Okay. When you say they came and took the book was that the Church's Bible? What was...

RB: No it was uh...it was a list of all the names on it of the people that belonged to the church. And they called it disbanned the church so they took the book and sent it in to headquarters in Tennessee. And that uh...that let that church without anything. Today if they got a church and it goes down and not got enough members they sell that church. Well back then they couldn't sell this one cause it wasn't anything but an old school house. No it might have belonged to the county.

B: Oh Okay.

RB: So we kept the church going 'till we got one built.

B: So uh...you say when the Church of God first came into this area did your mother ever tell you when it came?

RB: No...no she didn't. But it was done uh...had to be down in the twenties. You know cause I joined in the thirties.

B: Okay. Could you tell me about some of your uh...beliefs like you know some churches Baptize people and they baptize in different ways. Why...

RB: Well now....

B: Come to join?

RB: Our belief is we baptize in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost. And we believe in divine healing. Well we go to the scripture that Jesus said "These signs shall follow them that believe, in My name shall they cast out devils, they shall speak with new tongues." We do that. "They shall take up serpents, and if they drink any deadly things it shall not hurt them. They shall lay hand on the seek and they shall recover". And he said "that was believers". So that's what we believe we believe we can do that.

B: Okay. Now when you say baptize is that full submersion?

RB: Uh-huh...yeah full submersion.

B: Okay.

RB: We don't believe there's any other way you know. That's our belief we don't' believe in sprinkle. We believe that Jesus was baptized with full submersion. John the Baptized him and then the straight way up out of the water. So we believe that's the way they baptize them man or woman you know.

B: No how about with your healing? Do you go to doctors at all or how do you all balance that?

RB: Yeah...yeah...we go to doctors but healing is something other that is divine. Uh...I have saw people that was blind get their sight. Now doctored and doctor them. We went to one lady one time had a little girl and she had her feet turned around backards and uh...supposed to had Rheumatic fever and the doctor said "she'll never walk as long as she lived", me and my wife went to that home we prayed for that little girl and her feet just looked like it was two big hands turning around and put her feet back straight. And she got up and walked. She's a young lady today and got her family. And never been back and we didn't do anything to her but just pray for her. We don't use medicine we use oil now we do anoint with oil. That's pure olive oil we anoint with...and we just put a little bit on their hand and on their head. And I saw many meracles do many meracles...many people's healed. And we believe in that. Although somebody...just like if I was gonna pray for you and you'd say Brother Richard said I go to the doctor. Now I'd say that's up to you. If you want to go to the doctor go. Or when I pray for people's children they say should I take it to the doctor I say that's your child. You want to take that child to the doctor you go on. If it's well it won't need nothing if it ain't the doctor will help it.

B: Okay. R

B: So that's the way we believe and I believe if you want to take medicine take it. But I believe you know will do anything. Just like one lady walked in the church and when she walked in the sperit (spirit) said she's taking to much medicine. Now at sounds crazy maybe to you but I walked over to that woman and I said sister what's wrong with you, you're taking too much medicine you throw that away and you'll be alright. And two women helped her in and we prayed for her the next night or two she come back to church on her own and could breath real good. But she took so much medicine it nearly killed her. You can over do anything you know.

B: That's true. How about uh...

B: Anybody...if you would Brother Brewer can you explain some more about your beliefs and especially about uh...healing? What do ya'll call it when you talk about healing?

RB: Uh...we can it...it's just plain healing. We just call it divine healing uh...see I don't heal the people. And the crowd don't heal people but God does. And there's a time when your anointed see they's a difference in anointing. There's anointing comes with that healing. When you feel that anointing you feel this sperit (spirit) of the Lord on you, and like if I was gonna pray for you I can tell where you are healed or not. I lay my hands on you and I can feel the sperit (spirit) of God move out of me into you. And I can say right then your healed, your well. And I...it's never failed...it's never failed. I have never told somebody in my life that they were healed that hasn't been healed. I've never told somebody that something's gonna happen to them that hasn't happened to them. But God is with...has been with me. Uh... it's something that God does. He speaks individually to you they were...they was uh...I was working in my yard one day and the Lord told me to go to Logan to the hospital tell a man to pray. Well I went and told that man and he said I nearly died I said did you pray. He said no, I said "brother the Lord told me to tell you to pray", he said, "I don't want to pray". I said, "I told you the Lord told me, sent me out drove 25 miles and you better pray". He said, "no I'm going home tomorrow", I said, "no you ain't, your gonna die tomorrow, Mr. tomorrow's the day you die". He said, "no preacher I'll see you in church", I said, "no you won't but I said if you see me in church God never spoke to me". I walked out of that room and the next morning he started to sign hisself out and pitched over dead. And I preached his funeral and when the Lord spoke to me...many times of things and when he does I do it. I go...I do what he tells me to. And I have never failed yet on whatever I've told somebody it's always happened.

B: Now do you...do you think that part of the reason that you have this is because you've lived a certain way?

RB: It's lived good yes mam. You know to me a Christian person is not just a Christian in church. He's Christian at home, he's Christian where he works, he's Christian where ever he's at. He's got to be a Christian. And uh...what I mean Christian is Christ like. You've got to be a good man or good woman where ever you're at. If you're gonna....if you want God to do something for you you've got to do something for him. I have fasted three different times forty days and nights never eat a bite. And uh...I did that to get close to the God 'till I could do things for God that I could help my people. I don't charge for nothing I do. See what I do, I do it freely. If I go to the hospital I don't you to offer me money when I come to that hospital I come there to pray for you. And uh...we had one man call...  ____ Mayhorn you may have known him. They called me one day and said he's gonna die. And I went to that hospital and they said preacher he had thirty minutes. And I went in and prayed for him and one of the nurses said Brother Richard said I believe if you prayed for him again he'd be alright. I walked back in and prayed for that man again and honestly I felt so good. I walked out and said he's gonna live. They said brother Richard he can't live. I said that ain't what I said, I said that man's gonna live. They can't hardly live thirty minutes well the man's still alive today. So uh...it's just you go on buy the feeling of the sperit (spirit) and the Bible said "they that live by the sperit (spirit) of God they are the sons of God". So the thing of it is this divine healing I've prayed for thousands of people that's got well. And I've prayed for a lot of people that didn't get well. But I didn't feel like they was well see.

B: What do you think it was? Was it a lack of faith on their part or....

RB: Well it could have been the lack of faith on their part or it could have just been their time to go. You know you've got a time to die and all the preaching in the world ain't gonna length your time or nobody else in all the doctorings of medicine you can get. And if uh...your times comes God don't spare you of course I've feeled like I've prayed for people that God spare their life. I feel like mothers have prayed for their boys that's on the battle front field that's still alive today. I had a lady to come to me one time down here at church and she said brother Richard my boys in the navy and I saw a bomb hit that ship. And said I'm afraid he'll drowned said would you pray with me...me and her joined hands I prayed with her you know it was about two years that old boy come home and said mommy I want to tell you something other, said our ship got torpedoed and said I thought sure it was gonna sink. And said I don't know how in the world he got to shore. She said son I saw it before it ever hit it. And surely undoubtedly that prayer stopped that thing from sinking. I believe that. See I...I...I'm a man of faith. I believe in divine healing. I believe in mericles If you tell me God spoke to you I wouldn't doubt you cause I know he's able to. God's able to speak to a person he'll speak to you in an audible voice. Now he speaks mostly through the sperit (spirit) to you. But he will speak out right to you. And I've had God speak to me...God told me one day in the church house...I was reading my Bible and I picked up my Bible and when I picked that Bible up the Lord spoke to me and told me there was a woman sick to pray for her. Well I looked around and there was such a voice you know I looked around and there wasn't nobody there but me. I picked my Bible and the same voice said ain't you gonna mind me I said yes. Lord I'll mind you I didn't know she was sick so I just got in my car and went to that home knocked on that door and children run in and said brother Richard run in said mommy's a dying...I said no mommy ain't mommy's just fixing to get well. And I walked to that bed and prayed for that woman and she jumped out of that bed and shouted, got ready and went to church. Now you can't tell me God didn't talk to me. See so uh...lot of people don't believe these things but they actually do happen. And the people's still alive.

B: That's uh...Yvonne DeHart that works down at the Center I think called you she said there was a time when some people brought a box of snakes into your church and said "here, handle them." What did you do?

RB: I handled them.

B: Was that something that you believed in doing or...

RB: Well I believe in doing it but I do not believe in packing them around. I don't believe in doing nothing for show, see. But they brought them in and I...so I just handled them. I had two copperheads, one in each hand. But uh...I feel this a way got power over them. That's like use to be   ____ on this it use to be what you called the pot bellied stove. Well we handled fire...you didn't handle that every night. But there's a certain time that the sperit (spirit) would move. When the sperit (spirit) moved you could reach your hand in that heating stove and get the far (fire) out or in the grate. I've saw them pack ever drop out of the grate. Ever drop of the far (fire) and reach your hand in the heatin' stove and I saw an old lady called Merkey Varney she's shouting and talking in tongues and laid her head over on a heating stove and it was cherry red and wrapped both arms around it. Never fringed her hair and it never burnt her clothes or anything. And I saw them take fire and put it to their bosom like this and pack it around 'till it'd get black and throw it down on the floor and go back and get more, and pack every bit of the far (fire) out of there. So we...we believe in the real power of God. Now you... anybody might handle a snake and not get bit you understand...but you don't sock you fingers down in red hot coals of fire and come out with two hand fulls with out getting burnt. God's in it or your burned up that's all. And uh...when you live like that God does things. But you got to live like that all the time. That's like uh...working in the coal mines with these men. I told my churches, I've pastored two churches, I said "I don't care what man walks in my pulpit with me I said them men work with me night and day. And they ain't a one of them that can point a finger at me and say they saw me doing something wrong. And I said they honor me and I've got a lot of them people saved that work with me in the coal mines. Well I live my life before. I think you can live your life in the coal mines as well as you can anywhere else. So uh...to me uh... why we do these things is we live good enough to do them. And you got to live good.

B: Explain to me about...about living good because I'll tell you I went...I visited a church yesterday and I walked out of the church and people were lighting up cigarettes and chewing tobacco and what do you all feel about tobacco, cigarettes, and alcohol?

RB: It's wrong. You see uh...let me just...let me kindly explain it to you.

B: Okay.

RB: To me tobacco is nasty, it's filthy, cigarettes is a damage to your health. We're not suppose to damage our body well both of them we've preached as absolutely a sin and it oughten to be done. And uh...I preached that women oughten to wear pants, or to wear shorts oughten to wear bathing suits if you're gonna go in swimming go in swimming with your dress on. We don't...we don't deprive them from going in swimming but don't go in there half naked. The Bible says to not do that. The Bible says in Revelations "I count you to buy me gold tried in the fire in white raiment that thou mayest be rich, uh...the shamed of thy nakedness not thou appear". So if he told them to buy them some clothes that their ashamed of their nakedness didn't appear that mean for men and women not to go...and uh...see when I started they didn't allow a woman to cut her hair. They didn't wear a necklace, they didn't wear...allow to wear an ear button or any such things like that. And our young woman wasn't allowed to wear bobby socks. What they call bobby sock you had to wear hose. And that was their foundation of our church which we keep that foundation the other churches has fell off. And you can't tell some of these women that are suppose to be church members from the world. And the Bible says "your living epistles seen and read of all men". In other words he said "by their fruits you'll know 'em...and there's something wrong somewhere. They've let down on the standard. And if it was wrong when you started...whatever you have to quit when you start it will be wrong as long as you live. Sin never gets no better...I don't...we don't we preach oughten to use alcohol no chewing tobacco, no smoke, no dip, snuff nothing like that.

B: How about the men, can they have beards or...

RB: They can wear a beard. But they can't wear long hair. The Bible said "it's a shame for a man to wear long hair". But I'd rather a man wut'en wear a beard. Other words who wants to see a big old dirty face preacher up there preaching, you understand?

B: Um-hum.

RB: To me uh...hit hurts you. It...it...it hurts you if people sees a preacher like that...they lose confidence in him. Out of all things a preacher most of anybody ought to want people to have confidence in them. And if they see one of them smoking a cigarette whether they're a Christian or not they ain't got a bit of faith in that feller. And uh...and the Bible says "it's a shame for a man to wear long hair". But the Bible says "if a woman wear long hair it's a glory to her, for her hair is given her a cover". Said "for this cause a woman ought to have long hair for it's a power on her head because of the angels." So to me it's necessary for the woman to leave their hair ago. Uh...we do if uh...a woman comes to our church I don't care if she's got her head shaved...you say nothing to her. We'd give her a chance and if she goes to cutting her hair we tell her not to do it. If a mans got long hair we don't say nothing to him we let him go, but we give him the space of time three or four month if we don't cut his hair then we tell him to. But we give them space to see how the other men, and like the women ...we give a woman if she's got all the make up on we say nothing to her we just give her a chance to see how the other sisters looked in church. And if she don't' straighten up then we talk to her. See we try to give everybody a space to keep them from feeling bad or not act like their not one of us cause we want everybody to feel good when they come to church.

B: Right should a man wear uh...pants and shirt or what...what...

RB: Yeah we don't allow a man to wear shorts. We don't' allow him to take his shirt off. I preached and I said they looked like a big harry ape chasing after a lawn mower. And the Bible told them to put on some clothes. Well uh...in the book of Deuteronomy says of a woman not to wear that it pertains to a man it's abomination and pants and some says it's uh...well like some people want to wear them they say why brother Richard they make that for men, fer woman...they make them pants for woman. I said "they certainly do". I said "they make dresses for men too". And they really do you know...I said how would you like to see me getting up in the pulpit with a pocket book hung on my arm and a dress on to preach to you people. I wouldn't like it...and I said I don't you with them pants on either. So that's uh...that's our standard and that's the way we live.

B: Now was there a scripture that...that you found about healing? Let me go back cause we've talked some about the scripture for...

RB: Yeah for divine healing yeah. Jesus said "Verily, verily I say unto you things that I do shall you do and even greater things shall you because I ascend to the father." So He healed and He said in the book of Mark "these signs you follow them that believe in My name shall they cast out devils they shall speak with new tongues, they shall take up serpents and if they drink any deadly it shall not hurt them. They shall lay hands on the sick and they shall recover". And the book of James it says "is there any sick among you let him call the elders of the church and let them pray over him and anoint him with oil in the name of the Lord and the pray of faith will save the sick and the Lord shall raise him up". So he says for us to do that if there's anybody sick.

B: Okay.

RB: So the disciples did that and he said we can do that. So we do it.

B: Ok now how about speaking in tongues? Now when does that kind of...when does that happen?

RB: That comes uh...we preach that the first thing you do is you go to the alter you ask the Lord to forgive you of your sins. Ok and when you feel your sins is gone the next thing you need is the Holy Ghost and that's...that's when you begin to say God give me the Holy Ghost. Now when the Holy Ghost comes you uh...absolutely speak with tongues...I can give you some scriptures if you want to and uh...as I've already give and Mark said "speak with other tongues". Alright and the book of Acts second chapter of Acts they were all in one place and one accord and the Bible said suddenly there came a sound from Heaven as a rushing mighty wind, filled all the house when they were seating there appear them clothed in tongue like there was a fire set upon each of them and they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and begin to speak with other tongues as the sperit (spirit) gave utterance". Now in other words that's when they first got the Holy Ghost was on the day Pentecost (Pentecost) and that's when they spoke with tongues as the sperit (spirit) gave utterance. Now Peter preach to the Gentile people uh... the household of Cornelius and he had six brothers with him because Cornelius a Gentile it was agin the law for him to go there. But he come there and Cornelius uh...had been praying but he hadn't had the Holy Ghost and he told Peter said the Lord told me send after you. And he said it's good that you come said now I want to know about this and Peter opened his mouth and began to preach to him Jesus and while he spake these words the Bible said the Holy Ghost fell on all them that heared the word. They of the circumcision were astonished as many came with Peter for on the Gentiles was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost for they'd heared them speak with tongues. Now Paul Apostle in the 19th chapter the book of Acts that was in the 10th I just quoted you but the 19th chapter of Acts the Bible said "when Apollis was at Corinth Paul had to pass through the upper coast came to Ephesus finding certain disciples there. Now they were preachers and he ask him have you received the Holy Ghost since you believed. They said we've not as much as heard where there be a Holy Ghost or not. He said unto what was you baptized unto, and they said unto John's baptism, he said John Verily baptized with water onto repentance saying that you should believe unto him you should come after, that was unto Christ Jesus when they heard this words they were baptized in the name of the Lord, Jesus and after Paul had laid his hands on them they received the Holy Ghosts spake with tongues and prophesied and the number of men were about twelve. So any place you read where they got the Holy Ghost they spoke with tongues. So to me if you don't speak with tongues or stammering lips you've not got the Holy Ghosts. The Bible said for with stammering lips and another tongue would he speak unto these people. So you either have to speak with stammering lips or other tongues one...and that's how we know if we've got the Holy Ghosts for sure is when the sperit (spirit) speak to us. And that's how...and Jesus said himself it's send us another comforter which may abide by us forever. And the fifteenth chapter of St. John he said even the sperit of truth when he come he'll testify me and you will bare witness. Well if it don't testify it's not there. Testify means to speak you know. So Jesus said hisself it's in...and in the first chapter of Acts there. And being assembled together with him he commanded them not to part from Jerusalem wait for the promise of the father. He said for you've heard of me for John truly baptizes with water but you shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost now many days hence. Then they ask him saying Lord Wilt thou restore the kingdom of Israel he said it's not for you to know the time or the season the Father put that in his own power, but you shall receive the Holy Ghost. Not many days hence. So uh...it's a command for us to get the Holy Ghost and people don't get it. Now the Bible says in Corinthians we're witness these things so also is the Holy Ghost that God gave to them to obey them. But people ain't got it...just looks like they ain't obeyed the Lord. He's gonna give it to them that obey... something wrong somewhere. But a lot of churches you see now a lot of churches and I don't quarrel with these churches...I don't uh... these other preachers they preach what they want to I don't...I have a radio program and I've had it for over eighteen years and I don't preach at these other preachers. I don't throw off on them that's up to them and God. I get along with all these preachers.

B: Now Yvonne told me to ask you...she said there were times when you would work and then you'd having a revival at the same time now can you explain any of those cases?

RB: Yeah...yeah I sure can. uh...I've had uh...I've worked in a coal mines and come in and just barely get ready and go to uh... revival and sometime we had them six or eight weeks at a time. I can preach and uh....one that we lasted so long in. we's there about eight weeks and the last service I had I closed out after two o'clock in the morning. And I had people to go to the alter after one o'clock in the morning and we had so many people in that place a going to the alter and everything that I couldn't close out and I would only get home about an hour before I had to go to work. But I worked uh...I never missed a shift. I went to work sleepy and I'd say Lord you know I was trying to do your work now keep me awake...and he kept me awake. You know I can say something or other most of the preachers in our area can't say not even if they've been serving God a year I've only missed one service in my life that church a going on down here and me being at home. And I missed one.

B: What happen...were you sick?

RB: I went to the dentists and they pulled my tooth and took it out through my noise and blacked both my eyes. I just looked so bad that I didn't go that night but I many a time I wished I had. you know I could have went. But uh...I missed one service. Now I go off on trips and things and miss church but I'm not at home when I miss church I'm not at home. I go...I go...I take a vacation each year. Me and sheriff's going on vacation next month. Sheriff of the country. He's my buddy I caused him to get saved. So that's the only time that I miss church is when I'm actually gone you know. If I'm home and church's going on and I used to have to walk to church. I've walked from here to Matewan to church. I've walked from here to Delbarton to church. I've walked from here to Newtown to church. And I loaded coal in the coal mines and I'd come in the bath in a wash tub. We didn't have no...we didn't have no electric lights no water like we got now. My wife had to heat my water on what we call a tea kettle on a fire place or on the stove. And I'd take a bath and I'd walk that mountain again and go to church and back.

B: When did you meet and marry your wife?

RB: In '37....'37. We'd done been married over 50...right at 52 years now. Had to do over I'd marry her again.

B: Now was this...this was about the time you joined the church?

RB: Yeah uh-huh.

B: Was she in the church already?

RB: No we went to that alter together. Three months ah...we got married the 27th of November went to praying the 20th of February, 1938.

B: Now what's the role of woman in your church? What can a woman do in the Church of God and in your church?

RB: Well uh...woman teaches Sunday school uh...sings and plays music they have a better role and if they want to pray for the sick they can pray for the sick. See I believe woman can pray for sick as well as men.

B: Okay.

RB: So they've got as good role as a man. But it's just like everything else uh...we've got some elder woman, people get sick they call them to pray for them. Well they've got confidence in them woman you know. And uh...

B: How about preaching?

RB: Well we allow women to preach to. Yeah...we believe that woman can preach but they've got to meet the standards you know. You can't have a woman up there short hair a preaching and uh...ear buttons and things i don't' even want one to sing for me if they got that junk on.

B: Okay.

RB: It's a little hard to digest I guess but that's it.

B: Right.

RB: If they've got all that stuff on I don't want them up there singing. I don't....we don't want sinners playing our music, or singing songs for us. I say if they gonna sing let them get saved.

B: Now how old does somebody have to be before they can get saved?

RB: Uh...that...that just depends on the child. We let children pray. I believe they can get saved from the time they're...they're a little bitty feller. Although I feel they're already saved, you know. Truly I believe all children's saved up until so far and I don't know...I don't know I don't think no preacher could put emphasis on when a child comes of age to accountability. Cause in the day that we live in children's more smart right now at the age of seven or eight years old than I was when i was eighteen. You know facts of life and things of the world they're more smarter in it right now than I was when i was eighteen years old. But we never had nothing. And what theaters we had they was silent. You know silent movies. You guessed what they was saying. Somebody didn't read it, they'd put it on the screen what they said. So uh...children pray I like to see little children pray.

B: Now do you all hold yourselves off form the world I mean do you watch movies? How do you feel about movies?

RB: No we...we don't go to no movies but we watch television which is just as bad. I think television is the worst thing that ever come in the country.

B: Um...why is that?

RB: Cause it's got more foolishness on it. And we wouldn't go to a movie and watch it but you sit here in the house and watch it.

B: Okay.

RB: See. I don't think...I don't think it's wrong to watch them if you've got sense enough to cut them off. But if you watch every filthy thing on there and cussing things like that I don't think Christian people ought to listen at it.

B: Okay.

RB: It's kindly up to individual, you know but now we do preach this, if you think it's a sin you can't do it. It's a sin to you. Whatever you think is unclean to you that the Bible teach you...to you it's unclean. And that's the way we believe and if you thinks it's a sin to you don't do it. Or if I tell you...that bothers me I wish you wouldn't do that. You ought to quit for my sake.

B: Okay.

RB: I'm not talking about foolishness I'm talking about you know just like uh...I'd catch you a smoking a cigarette and I'd say honey that...that bothers me. If might not cause you to be lost but it really bothers me and it hurts me. For you ought to have enough love about you to quit it for my sake.

B: Okay. Now how about sending the children to school? Do the children go to regular school?

RB: We send them to regular school. Now some people uh...don't have to be Christian but some people wants theirs to go to a Bible school or Christian school. To me our schools is good enough for our children. They's just one things I don't agree with, on our public schools, I don't think that children ought to have to be made to go half naked to be a scholar. I think they ought to be able to wear their clothes and uh...I would never let my girls...I have five girls and two boys. I would never let my girls wear my little gym suits and things. I said it's wrong and they called me about it and said we'll cut their grades and I said well you just go ahead and cut their grades they ain't going naked no how. So they didn't cut their grades. I said we're holiness people we don't believe in our children going naked, I don't raise them that way. You know the Bible said train up a child the way it should go. Well if your gonna train you're child if you train it to go about half naked when it grows up it's gonna do the same thing.

B: How about going away to school? How about going to college? What...

RB: That'd be alright. I've got a grandson right now. That is a preacher uh...that uh...got four years in something. Four years and a half of college. You might know him...he worked for B & L Jewelry. Gary...Gary Starr.

B: I may have seen him.

RB: Yes sir and he...he spent four years and a half in college. I believe...I believe the more education to me now see I just wish to God that I had it, education you know I see the need of it. I wish that all the children when all the Christian people could get a good education. And when a preacher preaches they go home and get their Bible and find out whether he's preaching the truth or not. I hope they don't never run into a feller like I did. I ask him to come to Sunday school and said i don't need to. I said that's where you learn the Bible. He said well don't you know the Bible, I said yeah. He said if I didn't think you's preaching the truth I wouldn't come back and listen to you no how. I said yeah but you ought to read it for yourself, he said that's what I'm talking about. I'm expecting you to tell me the truth. You know that's a bad way to feel. You know I think uh...people ought to read after a preacher. See whether he's preaching the truth or not. You don't take everything a preacher says. Some of them don't' even tell the truth no how.

B: What would you do if somebody came up and said brother Brewer I don't' think you preached that right? What would you do?

RB: I'd be alright. I'd say well....just tell me how I done it wrong and buddy we'll try to straighten her out. Yeah. I wouldn't give them no big arguement they got a right to their opinion.

B: Your uh...you men that worked for you, you think they treated you any different because they knew you were a preacher?

RB: Well I feel like uh...I feel like they did, yeah. They treated me respectfully. It's like I worked with men that uh...and one man particular they put me in the mines loading coal with him and he cursed. Oh that feller cursed every breath. And we had a real bad top and I'd say son you oughten to curse like that. I can't help it. And uh...I'd look out and I could load coal either way so the real bad place I'd say hey bud you get over here and let me have that place. He said preacher why do you do that. I said son there's a big reason if I get killed I'm saved, if you get killed you're lost. Little while that feller quit his cussing. And someone ask him said why did you quit your cussing. He said ah...you don't know who I worked for. Said that man might have to pray some slate off me sometime. And I just lived so good before me he got ashamed of himself. You know to me if I see you're trying to do something another that...that's right. I ain't gonna bug you about it. Matter of fact I'll leave you alone. That feller he just had a habit of cussing, cussing, and cussing you know after he saw I was really trying to live right and I don't believe in joining in with a lot of foolishness you know. So...he just quit his. So he did real good. He told him he says he's the best buddy I ever had.

B: So he changed his ways after working with you?

RB: Oh yeah. Sure. Well the Bible says "we ought to be a fruit vine Christian". I call a fruit vine Christian is another person causing anyone to live like you do.

B: Now how about politics and being a Christian? How does that fit in?

RB: Okay in politics I believe any Christian if they want to ought to go vote. But I do not believe that they ought to go down there and stand on the ground and try to get somebody to vote for somebody else. I believe that's your own doing if you want....you vote for who you want to. If you're republican vote republican. I got nothing against you if your a democratic. I got nothing aginst it. Other words I believe uh...that you ought to be as free...matter of fact in your politics I feel this way you ought to make up your own mind who you want to vote for. That's your decision. So I don't...I go vote, I vote but I don't stay on the ground.

B: If you don't mind me asking what is your politics? Are you a democrat...

RB: Democrat.

B: Okay. Why are you a democrat?

RB: I'll tell you I don't know. I guess cause my parents always was. But now I have voted for republicans. In other words uh... say you...I knew you was a republican you was a good woman and you was running some office I'd cross over and vote for you if I knowed that the one on my side wasn't much good. I try to vote for the best on (one).

B: Uh-huh. Okay.

RB: To me in a way I hadn't got no politics. I vote uh...and in the primary election you know you have to vote the same for one side. But in the general election when it come down yo electing the people I go in there and I vote for who I want to.

B: Oh Okay.

RB: and I feel like everybody else ought to do the same thing.

B: How about say there was a war to come up and your grandson here was old enough to fight, would you want him to go or...how would your decision be made?

RB: Okay in that condition what we always taught out people to do uh...they're not a conscientious objector as far as that part concern but they'd go and they'd tell them they didn't believe in uh...killing to give them something else. And we believed they could go in there and work in uh...rescue squads works the ambulance work with the people on the field...help...help take care of the wounded, the sick and things. Work in their hospitals. We don't deprive them from going to war but we just don't want them to take up a gun to kill a man.

B: Okay. Did that work during Vietnam say....

RB: That worked...

B: in particular?

RB: Yes it did.

B: So none of your young men had to fight against their will?

RB: No hunt-uh...None of them had to fight against their will.

B: Well is there anything that I haven't ask you about today that you wanted...you'd would like to share with me?

RB: Not as I know of. I've told you everything that I know. I've tried to be as honest with my answers and telling you things as I possible knew how. And I don't think I've made a mistake on any of it.

B: Well thank you for talking to me today.

RB: Your welcome.

B: This is Becky Bailey it's Friday, June 21st I'm getting ready to attend Brother Brewer's evening service and I have a few more questions that I'm going to ask him and he's going to answer on this tape.

RB: I don't know too much about Isaac.

B: Okay.

RB: All I know is what my dad told me and uh...that's very little.

B: Was he a relative of yours?

RB: He was my dad's first cousin if I understand it.

B: He was? So did you ever meet him?

RB: No, no, I never seen him in my life.

B: What did your dad tell you about him?

RB: Well, he told he was with he was with the union men see to start with and then uh...it wasn't that caused him to get killed he hit a man in Matewan and knocked him down that man on the ground pulled a pistol and shot him and uh...they fought over somebody I don't know what it was all about.

B: Did your father ever tell you what year that was?

RB: No.

B: Do you know was you think it was probably in the 20's you think?

RB: It had to be down in the 20's here.

B: Let me check and make sure your microphone is on.

RB: Okay.

B: Okay. So, but Isaac hit a man and then the man shot him and killed him?

RB: Yeah, hit him and knocked him down.

B: Did your father ever tell you about any of the union troubles back in the 20's?

RB: No, no he didn't tell me about none of 'em, but uh...they had a lot of troubles see in the 30's when we really got the union started and I got in just about the time the union got started.

B: Well the other experience I wanted to ask you about was when you had your heart attack if you wouldn't mind sharing what happen to you when you had your heart attack?

RB: Ok, you got that on?

B: Yes sir.

RB: Well, what happened see I was in...I was in Huntington I was hurtin' real bad you know and I was in uh...St. Mary's Hospital and all of a sudden I just uh...well, I thought I fell asleep you know, but I went to what you would call the paradise of God matter of fact many of the Saints said I had Baptized, Preach a Funeral we were together and we were shoutin' oh, they on big white robes and we were talkin' and we was doin' I was never so happy in my life not a pain nothing bothered me and they shocked me back to life and when the shocked me back I didn't know I had died you know, but accordin' to record I'd been dead for six minutes and uh...so uh...they said you're back...you're back don't get excited I said I don't know what to get excited about I'd like to know what you hit me with I thought they hit me with a sledge hammer or something other you know it really hurt and uh...they said they shocked me back to life and uh...when I went to Michigan to have a heart operation they was interviewing me over there and we seen you were dead for six minutes and they ask me did I see anything and I told them about goin' to heaven, about goin' to the paradise of God, seeing God's people and uh...I ask that nurse I said you probably don't believe that she said oh, yes we do said we've got plenty of statistics and it says that there's light beyond distance so they really believed it and I really didn't do that and uh...it was just uh...I was hurtin' real bad and all of a sudden it's just like I went to sleep you know wasn't a pain nothing dreads to be die, but a death ain't no more than that and they said I was officially dead for six minutes if it ain't no more than that it's just like uh.. you'll layin' down and all of a sudden your asleep and that's it and it was beautiful matter fact uh...the place I was in I just like to go back I ask 'em why they brought me back like that you know why didn't they leave me alone I was ready you see and uh...I believe the Lord sent me back to preach some and give some message to preach and I'd tell my people that's why I preach so strict, straight and clean to my people, because God sent me back for that very purpose and I'm hear for that purpose.

B: And you got to see people that you'd known?

RB: Yes sir, many of 'em that I knew and uh...shouted in church with, been with, Baptized, preach their funerals and everything and they were very much alive and they were everybody was happy there was nobody sad everybody was happy I could tell you about another event I never told you about uh...back many years ago they's an old man named Bill Varney and his wife was name Lou... Loula and Uncle Bill we called him Uncle Bill all the time he was uh...a regular Baptist suppose to...that was his belief he wasn't anything, but that was his belief and he didn't believe in holiness and we talk about going to church and then he'd say I don't know no church you go to you might go down at that Frolic. Well, Sister Varney took uh... uh... stroke and she was paralyzed 27 days and couldn't move and they Dr. White was available at that time back in Red Jacket and they went and got him and he come over and told Uncle Bill he said you might get her to the hospital and they might take her, give her something to let up pain, but said she'll never walk as long as she lives said she ain't got long here and she'll not walk or anything so, he told her and she said I believe if you'd get Brother Richard to pray for me I'd be alright, but you may imagine how much he hated to get me to pray for that woman so, he sent after me and I went down and he stayed at the foot of the bed and I went to the head of the bed and I kneeled down and begin to pray as I prayed that leg that she was suppose to never move no more begin to move when I got done prayin' she set up and begin to walk and that arm that was paralyzed was healed and they both went to church and got saved and Uncle Bill went and got the Holy Ghost and uh...you know he was one of the greatest helpers ever I had he was singer and a shouter. he's uh...he lives in Alabama now, but that happened and uh...then one day she had cancer of the throat she took cancer of the throat and I went to that home and prayed for her for that and that she got healed she said she felt that cancer roll up and go down her arms and out her finger tips and she never did have cancer then. got healed and uh...them things happen. many things I could tell ya that happened you know and it's a long story, but God's been with me all down through the years.

B: You say he used to call your service a Frolic?

RB: Huh, huh yell.

B: Did you all have people...

RB: We shouted. see what it was we shouted and they dance in the sperit and a lot of times instead of him a callin' it a meeting he'd say his children want to go down you know, because they liked to see people shout and said I don't know no church you go to you might go down to the Frolic that's what they call it, but he was the shoutin'est old man you ever seen when he finally got saved.

B: Did people mock you all for your ways?

RB: Oh, yeah...yeah.

B: What would people say to you?

RB: Well, they would mock and call us Holy rollers and uh...before we built the front on our church over there when I was younger I'd preach and run back through the building sometime a shoutin' and people would jump up and run out the door and they'd say you ain't gonna throw that stuff on me they thought I throwed powders on people make 'em shout and I said Lord God if that's what make you shout I'd get me a barrel full and just take a bath in it, but you know they really...they really believed that we threw powders on people that cause 'em to shout they was afraid of us and that place where they had the church over at Varney we wasn't allowed to walk that...we wasn't allowed to walk that road there that belong to some people that before the county took it over and everything and we had to wade the creek we wasn't allowed to cause we's holiness people we wasn't allowed on that land, but the Holy Ghost said one day in a bottom under a apple tree the holy ghost said that we would own that land and that we would build a church there and the gate's of hell wouldn't prevail agin it. well, It said a foreigner would takes that man's place certainly we own that land today and a Spaniard took that man's place it belongs to God's people now. So these things that was prophesied through the sperit actually has come true down through the yeres no prophesy that's ever been prophesied like that didn't come true. I had one ole brother he's dead now Brother Harry Maynard he uh...he said he was driving by where our church is now and said that he stopped his car and told his wife he called her mommy he said "mommy said listened...the angels sing" said "I don't know what's gonna happen here, but someday God's gonna have a church here" and uh...that was many yeres(years) before we built the church and when we got the land we built the church there he told me he said you needn't to never worry about it going down said God said it would be here forever so, we've always had a good church there.

B: I have a...my colleague that came down here with me he wanted me to ask you about the scripture about uh...you know don't be afraid of the serpents and things like that he ask he wanted to know if you ever heard of people drinkin' of the poison have you ever heard of that?

RB: Yeah, oh, yeah I haven't done it myself, but I've knowed of people that drank the poison my wife was present one night and uh...some people had a church and they handled serpents and drunk some poison and the man said if that's really poison give it to my dog and they wouldn't give it to 'em theirself, but he took that poison and give it to him and killed that dog it didn't hurt them and the Bible said uh...the Bible said if they drank any deadly thing. now I don't think he wants us to force ourself on anything this is what the Bible actually says "These signs shall followed them that believe, in My name shall they cast out devils they shall take up serpents, they shall speak with new tongues, they shall take up serpents and if they drink any deadly thing it shall not hurt them...that word if's in there if they happen to I believe after you turn thanks over or something other even if it was poisoned if you didn't know it I believe that God will sanctify that it won't hurt you it happened down through the Bible the people went out and gathered wild gourds and then as they eat the gourds they didn't know that it was poison their stomachs begin to hurt and they begin to cry out to the man of God, said "Man of God there's death in the pot he took a hand full of meal and threw it in with 'em he said go ahead and eat I've cured it, so it wasn't poison anymore, so these things it still happens in our day uh...if he could answer back in the old day why don't he answer today, so I saw the devils cast out of people, I saw 'em take up serpents and I do know they drank the poison and I saw 'em lay hand on the sick and them get well I saw the blinded eyes open, deaf ears unstopped, I saw the lame walk, I've saw crooked feet made straight and people they said couldn't live that God's healed and their still alive so, it's up to God, God will...the preacher don't do that don't misunderstand what I'm tellin' you about. the preacher don't do that, the church don't do that, but God answers their prayer and he does it through them, in other words, we're like an instrument we're like that light bulb up there turn that power off from it and it's just useless, but put the juice...and that's way a Christian when God ain't with 'em and ain't movin' in 'em, their just as useless as that light globe to lay hands on the sick and them to be healed God's got to anoint ya with a special anointing just like if you was takin' up serpents they a special anointing comes to that if you're gonna handle fire they's a special anointing comes to handle fire and when that anointing comes you know it and that fire can't hurt you, can't burn, that serpent can't bite you say some gets bit and killed they do it because their not under the anointing see, so these things...these things happen and anytime you're under anointing of God, God bids you to do something other it will happen, but you don't do it on your own it's like speakin' in tongues we speak in tongues oh, we believe everybody who gets the Holy Ghost speaks in tongues, but you don't speak in tongues anytime you want to you only speak when the sperit moves on you to speak and if the sperit don't move on you to speak in tongues your makin' a mock, you ain't talking in tongues it's just mockin', but when the sperit moves then you speak with tongues and then if God wants you to understand what you've said he gives you the interpretation and you tell the church what you said, so these things this the way this thing works it works by a higher power than the preacher or the church members it's all in...divine healing, divine power, divine talkin' in tongues, divine interpretation, anything that we do it has to be in divine sense of the power of God.

B: Okay. (Question was cut out - I think the question is, "Did you ever hear about the Matewan Massacre".

RB: No, I heard about uh...Chambers man and I forget who the other fellow was went up here to Welch and they shot them on the courthouse steps in Welch, but I didn't here nothing else about it.

B: Well, let me...let me ask you one other thing then, if you had to pick a special scripture or something that you felt was really.. ...or if you had to pick one scripture out entire Bible, which one means the most to you? Is there one that you can name that you can think of?

RB: Well, I would think it be Mark...16th chapter of Mark 'ginin' at the 8th verse. B: Okay.

RB: "He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved and he that believeth not shall be dammed, these signs shall follow them that believe, in other words, that controls the whole thing that I really base my whole life on is I believe in signs following believers now I believe that no man, no woman gets the Holy Ghost without speakin' with tongues or stammering lips, out of the Bible.

B: Okay. Yvonne told me that she heard that when you were working...you were still workin' that you made yourself read a certain amount of the Bible every night is that true? Could you tell me about that?

RB: That's when I first started I used to read 40 chapters a day.

B: Forty chapter a day?

RB: Forty chapters huh.

B: Startin' from the very beginning?

RB: Yes sir, went through the whole Bible like that and I read and studied it after I read it like that then I went back and picked up passages in it that I studied uh...because you know readin' it wonderful, but to find out what you're talkin' about you have to study about it and line it out through the Bible.

B: Have you ever heard of people doin' this, this they feel troubled and they felt drawn to open the Bible and they've opened the Bible and their eyes have fallen upon something that has made them feel at peace? Have you ever of heard of that?

RB: Yes sir, and that's not all many times they open the Bible and God shows 'em exactly what he wants it's like uh...one lady here I ask Bible questions she couldn't find that Bible question, so she went in and prayed and ask the Lord, said Lord I need to know that I've searched, I've hunted I can't find it now, show me where it is, just went and opened the Bible and there it was and she laughed she said "I found it" I said ain't no way I could trick you on that one because God shows you and ain't way I can hide it so, uh that happens, that happens to just about anyone that will...what it all boils down to is you actually wantin' something other, you being honest with God, honesty is what God wants he don't want our uh...our flattery he just wants us to be really honest they's a scripture in the Bible that tells you about a Pharisee, how he went in and he prayed and he thanked the Lord he wasn't like this publican here, in other words, a sinner man he said "I'm not like him I've fast, I pay my ties, I do all these things and that other man the Bible said the publican always smote on his chest said Lord have mercy on me if sinner, went more justified than the man that prayed the long prayer, because he was honest in his'n and the other feller was doin' it for flattery so, what God wants you and I to be is just really honest with him if you want something other go to him sincerely and earnestly and he'll answer anytime you pray to God with a sincere heart and open mind he'll answer your prayers.

B: Well, thank you for talkin' to me again and I'm looking forward to the service tonight.

RB: Alright.

B: Brother Brewer your wife has suggested that I ask you about your son Dickie would you tell me about that?

RB: Yeah, uh...he was just a baby and my wife had him in her arms at the breakfast table and I was drinkin' some cocoa and I ask him I said "honey would you want a drink" and he said "uh-Huh" and I gave that child a drink of cocoa and he just stiffened out in her arms and I grabbed him and went to prayin' for him cause we never did take our children to the doctors I prayed and uh...my uncle was there and he run everybody thought he was dead and my granddad come he took and laid him out, laid him out in the back room on a little table cause he was stiff and I had to take both of my arms to bend one of his'n and uh...I prayed, I prayed about 2 hours and my grandpa kinda was a unbeliever anyhow and uh...I went through the room and uh...we had an old fashion mantle over a fireplace and the sperit of the Lord spoke to me and said "Anoint him with that oil" well I went and got that oil...today I don't know what kind of oil it was, it might have been caster oil or some kind of oil, but anyhow it was oil and I got that ole boy off'n that table and they said leave him alone don't you see he's dead I said no, sir I ain't leavin' him alone I took and laid him on the bed and took that oil and poured it on him and I bowed before God and I'd already prayed about 2 hours and I said now Lord lookie here he just a child I've lived here a long time you take me and leave him and you told me to anoint him with oil and you know one thing when I done that that child begin to move and when he begin to move in about I'd say between 3 and 5 minutes he was down in the floor playin' wasn't a thing wrong with him God healed him, God brought him back from the dead and days after that I worked in the coal mines and uh...he would tell his mother he said mommy, I see daddy standin' out there and I'd would be in the coal mines, but I was so present with him at all time and you know what he's uh...I believe he's about 42 years old now, 46 years old today I think and he's in good health he's not a Christian, but God did absolutely bring him back from the dead. We had a lady die in the church uh... you possibly knew her ole Sister Hanney she died and she's was dead about a hour and something other we had a registered nurse there said she was dead and I said no sir, we kept prayin' for her and uh... God brought her back to life and they had covered up and everything and she got up and walked home she died last year, but she lived uh...I'd say 20 years from the time she died God brought her back. God done a many...I could just it would take me all night to tell ya what God's done for me down through the years because I ask him sincerely and I didn't do them things I never healed nobody, but God has.

B: Ok, thank you.

RB: Your welcome.