Matewan Oral History Project Collection
Sc2003-135

Letha Cannada Interview

Becky Bailey: This is Becky Bailey for the Matewan Development Center Oral History Project summer 1989, it's Saturday, July 29th at 4:45 in the afternoon. I'm in the home of Mrs. Cannada and my first question for you Mrs. Cannada is if you'd tell me your full name and when you were born?

Letha Cannada: My name is Letha Cannada that's L.E.T.H.A. C.A.N.N.A.D.A. Letha Cannada.

B: Okay, and when were you born?

LC: I was born 1909, June the 9th.

B: June the 9th Okay. Is Cannada a married name or is that your maiden name is that?

LC: You say am I which?

B: Was that your married name Cannada or is that your given name?

LC: That's my married name.

B: Okay. What was your maiden name?

LC: My maiden name was Pruitt, my daddy was name Will Pruitt.

B: And where were you born?

LC: I was born in Russellville, Alabama and never was away 'til I was old enough to get away myself.

B: And when was that?

LC: I was good and grown when I left that, but I been here a long time ever since 1932 been right up and down this alley...valley here. B: What was your mother's name?

LC: My mother was name Lily she was a Gibson, both her parents were Gibson's.

B: And were they from Russellville, Alabama?

LC: Oh, yel, all my family's from Alabama, the grandchildren the ones born through in up here, but I was raised down there, never was able to leave 'til I got old enough to get away myself. "laughing"

B: How big of a place was Russellville? Was it a little town or was it a city?

LC: Where I was born?

B: Huh...huh.

LC: Oh, it was about like Weeason (Williamson), you been through in that era (area) hadn't (haven't) ya Weeason.

B: Williamson! Yes mam.

LC: Well, uh...this little town Russellville is about like Weeason,(Williamson) it was a better lookin' place look like to me in Weeason,(Williamson) but that's my home town and I ain't gonna talk about it either. "laughing". Is that air conditioner runnin' I'm kind a hard a hearing I ain't got my hearing aid in.

B: Okay.

LC: It's hot in here to me, about to burn up.

B: What did your father do for a living in Russellville?

LC: Uh...he was uh...a old man they don't have coal to much in Alabama, well they has developed that here lately last 20 or 30 years, they started you know uh...operatin' coal, but at the time when I grew up they had what you call oh (ore) and they stripped the dirt off of it and they picked the oh (ore) from the bad and they's what you call oh (ore) now I don't know what that is which they tell me they made arn (iron) out of it. They had ole mines just say ole mines, cause that's exactly what they were, I wa...I wa (was) raised down 'ere never was able to get away from there 'til I was good and grown, my oldest boy was about 10 years ole when I left from 'ere of course I've got more boys than that, but he was the oldest one and when I came away from there I came to Cincinnada (Cincinnati) and I didn't like Cincinnada too well it was a little bit too big of a town to soot me and I wudn't used to it either and uh...I uh...I had a brother that lived out here it was Red Jacket, way back up that holler I don't whether you heard of that back up in 'ere or not, but it used to be the times was so good here 'til if they was a good chicken coop you couldn't rent it cause somebody had already had it rented that's true somebody lived in that chicken coop. "laughing".

B: Oh, my goodness. LC: You couldn't rent a house or nothing here no kind of way that's the truth somebody done beat ya to it now I put that down in the floor I'm gonna get it up on 'ere a little bit now and uh... I came here and I stayed with my brother awhile I didn't like here to well and I left and went to Charleston I got a job by time I got 'ere I went to the Brown's Hotel that's right 'ere on the main street and I you know ask for a job I employed for a job and they called, come up after me the next morning you know and uh...I worked there a long time and then I got in with some people out at a little place you call Long Acre, West Virginia that's just across the river from Montgomery and Montgomery's about 29 miles down below Charleston I went down 'ere and I got a place to stay down 'ere and I stayed awhile and the superintendent his name was Mr. Russell sum'n (something) else was his name, but everybody called him Mr. Russell I think that was his last name and uh...he give me a job there where I was it was nothing, but what you call coke it was coke mines they burnt that stuff and then the mens had to pull out of them holes or pits or whatever it was and they spode (spilled) water on it and cooled it down and then they loaded it in railroad cars and uh...I after I got out there awhile and got straightened out and kind of got acquainted with the place well, I got a job takin' lunches out ever mornin' for breakfast, cause the mens had to wait over night for those cook ovens to burn down and then they would scramble the water and cool that stuff and when they pull it out it just be big red lumps of are (iron) and that's the way they made that coke, they loaded that coke in cars just like just like these folks up here loads coal and the cars and cars of that oh (ore) or whatever you called it that I...I call it oh (ore), because they made arn (iron) out of it and they would, it would come right by where I lived I could stand on my porch and just look off down through the railroad track and just cars and just nothing, but that big ole rusting lookin' stuff that they said that stuff had burned down to where it was all they had to do was crush it then and some how or another they melted it and it come out real long sheets of arn (iron), but it was funny to see it done yel.

B: Did you have to make those lunches or did you just carry 'em out?

LC: I had to make the lunches, I sold 'em that's the way I made my money now, I had to buy that food in I had 10 lunches if I had to order for 20 lunches they had a man would come around and he'd bring a sheet with them lunches on it ever how many lunches they wanted for breakfast that morning and them po' ole mens would work all night long sometime it be ten or eleven o'clock fore they would finish up and I'd have to take food out 'ere to 'em out on the job where they work, but I had a man would haul it for me he had a little I call it a one horse truck you know what I mean to a little bitty little truck, but it had a place back behind it and we just have'at back part of that truck just filled up, then people bought these ole time dinner buckets you know bottom and top one fit down there I just have buckets and buckets uh...it would be breakfast in 'em, but they were called dinner buckets now "laughing".

B: "Laughing", if you don't mind I'll go back and ask you a question about your family? How many brothers and sisters did you have?

LC: I've got...I've got five brothers and one sistee (sister) in my family.

B: How far back did you all know about your family? Say did you all ever hear any stories back about slavery days or anything when you were growin' up?

LC: No, we didn't have very many relatives I know you 'at when I got old enough I pulled out from my people and I came North and see down in 'ere where I raised was called South and I came up in here and I don't know to much about my people I'd write 'em and like that and then as the time went on we just got separated or something other I don't have any people down there now as I know of not, well maybe a few, but been so long since I've been down there to see 'em I got a sister right here in Pittsburgh now, I've been writin' her and tryin' to get her phone number and all I can't even get answer from her letters and I can't get her to talk to me on the phone I don't know what's wrong she claims she not gonna answer the phone after night if I call in the morning time she says she ain't gonna answer the phone in the morning well, I wonder what time would she want me to answer the phone I ain't gonna stay nowhere if I'm scared of that's true it's dangerous here to jump and around to answer the phone every time it ring well, I don't want to live in a place if it's like that myself and I wouldn't if I could get away no longer than I could now, that's true, but she's stays on there.

B: How did you travel up here when you came?

LC: How did she whut (what)?

B: How did you travel when you came up this way, when you left your family?

LC: I came on train.

B: On the train?

LC: I live little place you call Coal Valley Alabama at that time and uh...I had to come to a little places called uh...oh, I can't think of the name of that little ole place right now, but that's funny just slid off my mind, but anyway I had to go from out there on the camp to town to catch the train the little ole town was name and that's what I can't think of right now, Parish, Parish Alabama and I got a man that was a preacher now, great big heavy set fellow and he had...he had a car one these ole time ones you had to do it like that and crank it up.

B: Was it? "laughing".

LC: "Laughing". Yeah, and he carried me to, brought me to down to Parish to catch the train and I caught the train in Parish and I came to Birmingham and I didn't stop in Birmingham, I'd been to Birmingham several times, but I was tryin' to make it to right up here above Red Jacket Store I had a brother lived up that hollow up there you know I was tellin' you about it was a good chicken coop you couldn't rent it because somebody else had done rented it people were just there from foreign, different places they just that thick and anything to a brush hog well, if they could live in they done moved in it some how or another that's true if people had came out of the South and different places they was just that thick back up that hollow and uh...I got off the I'd got a train from Birmingham to Cincinnada and I didn't have sense enough to stay on...on the train if I had've known what I was doing I'd stayed on that same train and come clean in here to Matewan yeah, cause the same train would've bought me into Matewan, but I didn't know that I got off the train and uh...I got off the train Weeason, West Virginia and I got me a taxi all the way from Weeason clean up this Red Jacket hollow, but it was people up that hollow just like that, just like I tell ya if they was a good chicken coop up there somebody already had it and you couldn't rent it, cause somebody else done got it that's the truth so I went on up the hollow up and I had a brother up there and you wouldn't guess what it cost me from uh...Weeason a taxi all the way through here and on clean on up way on up that hollow up above where they

B: How much.

LC: ...where they uh...I believe it's the garbage live there that manage it, head man of it, he didn't charge me, but two dollars yes sir, two dollars from Weeason clean up that hollow that's the truth that was good money then yes, sir 'at is good money and uh...I was glad to get by at that I thought I was gonna have to pay at least as much as five dollars and that's all he charged was two dollars and I mean I had a little oh, a little truck about like 'is, but not quiet long as 'is he brought my trunk had two suitcases and he carried my suitcases to.

B: Who came with you? Did you have anybody come with you?

LC: I didn't bring nobody I was tryin' to get myself there, but I had a kid, my oldest son and he was already up here my brother come and beg me to let him take him home with him and I lived a little ways not to far from Parish and uh...I let him bring him up here and he lived way up this Mitchell Branch hollow at that time and I let him bring my oldest kid up here and I wrote for him to bring him home or send me the money and I'd come after 'im (him) I didn't have it to spare or he'd tell me if he'd get 'im, she'll come and get 'im I ain't gonna bring him back now, says I didn't come to get him to bring back kept on, kept on I went to a preacher there little heavy set fellow and I told him that I wanted my kid and I wanted to go see about it and bring it home and that man he took up collection that next Sunday at church and everybody just throwed in the money on the table for me to go and bring my kid home and uh...the next Monday morning I rode the train out of Birmingham into Cincinnada and that's the time I told you in place of gettin' a bus in place of me stayin' on that train in Cincinnada and came on here to Matewan I got off in Weeason (Williamson) got off in Weeason and got a taxi all the way up that hollow and the man he see'd I was a dummy or something other and he didn't charge me, but two dollars any other time I'd had to pay at least ten dollars, why it's ten dollars now to get in one and carry ya to Weeason from there to here all these people are so, short out here especially the widow people where they ain't got nobody you know to help 'em, now I's live off that little government check and that's the biggest thing I get is that little government check and honestly now when I'm sick I got a insurance it'll pay me a little bit that is if the doctor sees fit to fill it out for me, but they got to have the doctor's signature to pay it out, to pay it off and they pay me a little bit it ain't all that much, but every little helps that's true.

B: How old were you when your first child was born?

LC: How old is my first child?

B: No, how old were you when you had your first?

LC: I was near about 17 years old, wudn't quiet seventeen, he was borned in May and I would've been seventeen that following June.

B: Who helped ya give birth? Did your mama help you or did you have a midwife or a doctor anybody come help ya?

LC: I had a doctor they had rag doctors at that time down through there where we were then you had to go get him "laughing" that's another thing even how bad or how big hurry things was in your husband or somebody had to get on ole horse or mule or something and go way here somewhere and get the doctor and the doctor would come with you, you know the doctor would trail you or he'd be in front of ya cause everybody down there quiet kind half way knowed their own route you know and uh...my husband he went after this doctor and they come in and oh, he had a big pretty horse you thought so much to even care how bad you was sufferin' if you was sick and you went in and he just barely make the ole horse trot you know "laughing".

B: "Laughing".

LC: He didn't make the horse get in hurry for nothing you just suffered wait 'til that horse got there. "laughing" it's a long story, but I tell you the truth people made it through those days just like they do now that's the truth.

B: How much did he charge you for helpin' give birth to the baby?

LC: I don't know what he charged I think my husband give him five dollars that's all we had.

B: Was he a white doctor or a black doctor?

LC: He was white uh...we didn't have any white uh...any black, colored doctors, but I tell ya what they did have. They had ole ladies could do that same thing and she was admitted you know by the government or whatever it was and she was called a midwife I don't know whether you've ever heard of that or not, well now these was ole color ladies and if you couldn't get a doctor you could go get one of them that had been licensed to you know take care of you in that time, cause I started that in uh...I took that up to I can do that to, but since I've gotten older I seem to be 81 years old and I can't do nothing like that myself helpin' the other fellow out. "laughing" I don't want to be bothered with nothing like that, but I used to do it really I did I used to you know go to different ladies was sick and help 'em out I had permission from the government though you know couldn't do it unless you were you had to be licensed and that's been way back oh, my goodness I know of several kids sick I'd help out and they'd children girl by the name of Ellen Lightfoot and her husband never did have nothing he couldn't get a doctor, cause he didn't have nothing to pay the doctor much less me, but I was lied to go to her rescue if it was necessary you know and she couldn't get nobody so I waited on her with a couple of her children and not only that I've waited on a lots more of 'em to, but she was one live pretty close to me that I help out, but I had permission from the gov... you know from the government now I had to be signed up for that and I had to sturdy that and practice that before I could do it, but I had learned it I practice it all and I could do it now, but I don't want to I've done had enough of that kind of stuff "laughing".

B: What did you have to study? I mean did you have to pass a test to get that license or what?

LC: Well, you had to sturdy how I know one time I was with a lady and her baby was coming foot foremost and had to learn how to you know get in under there and turn that baby back around and let it come head foremost and then the next I had to sturdy is uh...how to do its navel when the baby is born that after birth effect that they call it is the navel growed to that baby's, baby's stomach and that baby's in a bag and that thing has got uh...holes over the son and that runs from the baby's stomach back into the after birth of when the baby's born you have to learn how to take that off, you have to cut it off so far and before you cut it make sure you tie a string around it just as close up to the not to close though tie a string around that baby's navel right up to his stomach like that and tie it good and tight and then when you got it tight enough you tie this end up here tie that to and then you cut right between that and don't cut it to close now, cause it might bleed cut it out far enough if it happen to start bleeding you can tie it again, but its...its easy learned it didn't take me no time to learn it, but I had to go to school to do that though, but they lied to me to do it I can deliver anybody's and anywhere baby that needed help and couldn't get a doctor there.

B: Where did you get that license? Where did you learn how to do that?

LC: I had to go to the...I had to have a doctor you know I had to practice on to a doctor, I went with that doctor just like a nurse from one child bein' borned and to another one and then he wouldn't do nothing he'd just stand back and see what I do and if I wudn't doin' right he'd correct me right then he say no, no, no say that's not right don't do that or something like that you see, yel but I learned it yel I did and then after I got to where I could deliver 'em by myself then he give me permission he had it put through an order that I could deliver they called it a grandma? at that time yel.

B: What state was this in? Was this in West Virginia?

LC: It was in Alabama.

B: Alabama?

LC: I was born and raised in Alabama I tell ya I never got away to that time I caught the train out of Birmingham into Cincinnada. "laughing".

B: "Laughing".

LC: And got a train out of Cincinnada to Weeason when I could've come right here to Matewan and got off yes, sir could got off in Matewan train stopped in Matewan at that time no, I got off in Weeason got me a taxi from there out here to Red Jacket clean up that holler to man see'd I was a fool to start with and he didn't charge me but two dollars.

B: On that train ride did you...was there a white section and a black section back then? Did you have to sit in a separate section? Was it segregated did you have to sit?

LC: Oh, yes it certainly was, but uh...they didn't segregate about the children bein' born now it didn't make no difference about what color, if it was lady and she was sick and need you, you had to go to her and care what hour of night after you got your license you know and was licensed to these things if they come and call for you you had to go you know unless you was so sick that you couldn't get up or set up now that's all they was to it.

B: Your brother that lived up here at Red Jacket was he a miner? Did he work in the mines up here is that what he was up here for?

LC: My brother yel, ever brother I had worked in the mine you take this lady down here in Matewan just as you go under that bypass spread hit's uh...girl live there she got one son is a preacher uh...I forget him Frank Jones I believe his name is, now my brother died and she remarried again and the man she married had some children and uh...this boy he stays there with his mother, his father died, but they stay there together yel, well now uh...at that time uh...you know uh...her and I both used to you know go out and help different people when they was sick like that, but I got a lot of relatives here I got three brothers baried (buried) right up here in this old cemetery. That boy he ain't no boy he's a grown man he's Dreama and then he's Debra's uh...father who works she ole something this here what is it? on the hill up there what is that?

B: The water plant, the?

LC: Some kind of like the Welfare, but it's not the welfare, what is that, that nursing home, now she's the head woman up at the nursing home now that's uh, my brothers...that's my brothers daughter wait a minute no that's my brothers granddaughter Jimmy Pruitt and he died, but he had three girls and that's Dreama, Deb and Audrey I believe her name is Audrey works somewhere here in Weeason I heard the last of her, last time I heard where she was workin' she was workin' in the mines I don't know maybe she is I don't know but I think she is and Dreama works here in Weeason somewhere I don't know exactly where it is, but I believe she works at one of them little uh...you know uh...little stands uh...whatever you call it right in long in there where uh...it ain't on the same side as Long John Silvers is it's back this way from there she works I can't think of the name of that place not right now, but anyway she works at some kind of little hotel, motel or whatever you call it right here in Weeason the oldest girl and then Debra's the next oldest one and she's over the nursing home on the hill now that's uh...my brothers uh...grandson that boy, them kids daddy is my brothers son that's William Pruitt I don't whether you ever saw him or not he had a stroke or something and he's in a wheelchair and he can't go nowhere unless somebody pushes him you carry him around in a wheel chair like that.

B: How many children did you have?

LC: How many did I have?

B: Yes.

LC: I got nine kids and every one of 'em boys I tried and tried and tried I wanted a little girl so bad and I didn't have none and when the nine one fell out here and they say it's a boy I signed off I ain't havin' narry (not) nother one "laughing" ain't nobody gonna talk to me about narry (not) nother one I guarantee you that, of course I ain't afraid now, but back at that time I could had cause to be 'fraid, but I ain't afraid now I think nine is enough I tried hard as anybody I wanted me a little girl so bad and I couldn't I can't have a little girl.

B: Now, the husband that you had in Alabama did he come with you or did you divorce or did he die or?

LC: Oh, he died I been married twice I was a Haircrow startin' with all my kids is Haircrow's and then after I came here to West Virginia way later I met another man and he three years before I met him he had lost his wife and well, we made up in about a year or little better and I was livin' right up here at Italy Camp then they call it before you get to Red Jacket Store and I didn't live there I lived, yes I did I live right there at Italy Camp and I met him a time or two and I went back over to Montgomery and when I came back here he, we met up again and then eventually we wound up or something "laughing", but he died it's been quiet some time, but he left me pretty good living yeah, I make out with it I have a little bit of income it's enough that I can make it I bought this little place out of it everybody talked about it when I bought this it was oh, it was trashy sure enough, but I had a whole lot done to it all this in here was nothing, but beaver boardin' and uh...I got young mens that knowed how to do this and I bought my material and stuff and had it done myself and I had this house linded (lined) inside it was just old paper you could just hit it and just bust the whole wall, this big ole stiff board and all through here and I had to have what ya call it that stuff you put in the wall what is that insolation something like that I had to have this house insolated and everything well, I got it for a little bit of nothing and it was whole lot to me though this house cost me six thousand dollars and it wudn't nothing but I increased it a little bit and it's enough to live in and wudn't a bathroom here yes, sir they was ole thing settin' out there in the corner there and uh...I got this here superiors down here to put a bathroom in here yel, I got a bathroom now, but at that time I didn't have one wut'en narry (none) in here I had the ole thing settin' out there in the corner.

B: When did you buy this place though?

LC: I bought it off of Mrs. Artis, you heard of Roscoe Artis's haven't you well, I bought it off of her I bought it in 1972 I believe it was and after I paid for it, got it paid out I just went to fixin' some things that I liked to have myself, cause they wut'en bathroom in this house when I first moved here.

B: When did you work in Montgomery? How long did you work over there?

LC: Over at Montgomery? Oh, I worked over there 'til my oldest boy was old enough to work and I went to the superintendent and begged him to put him to work I needed help you know just tryin' to make to make it on my own and I went to this superintendent his name was Mr. Russell what the rest of his name was I don't know, but everybody called him Mr. Russell and I talked to him about puttin' this boy to work and he did he had 'em to put him on it on Coke yard and then with the boy workin' and me sellin' lunches and all I got to you know kind of on my foot a little bit, but I sold lunches a long time and I don't know exactly how long I did, but after that I moved up above uh...where I was at to a little place you call Buma? its was owned by the Alley Coke and Coal Company I think it was Alley of people I don't know what they done, but they didn't get coal uh...they didn't get oil out I don't know what they did it was some kind of power or something that they made you know it's a long story, but you know some of it I can remember it and some of it I can't "laughing".

B: Tell me something you've mentioned things before we started the tape things that your mother used to say, what kind of little sayings did your mother say, say if somebody I don't know did something and there was a superstition what kind of things did your mother used to say when you were a girl?

LC: Something like superstition? Oh,     I don't know she had plenty of 'em, but when you want to think of something you can't think of nothing "laughing". My mother used to have a hard time tryin' to break me from askin' questions.

B: Oh, really.

LC: I'd ask questions and they don't treat ya now, like they do now you take little girls now they ain't but five and six years old they know near about much as any grown person just about it, but if I spoke somebody down over here my mother always smack the fire out a me "laughing" she'd give me a slap in a minute I never will forget now I just thought it was so wrong I had a cousin and uh... she was a great big girl and she had made a mistake and she had a little boy baby it was good size about like my girl's little grandson and uh...one day I don't know the devil made me do it I don't know what else and I said mamma I said where is Adalines? husband we had a daddy and I thought that Adaline? ought to had a daddy to because she had a great big child and his name was Austin and uh...she said oh, don't get fresh said now you know Adaline? doesn't have no husband oh, what did she say that for I says uh... ain't got no husband well, mamma tell me how in the world did she get Austin? I thought she had to have a husband I didn't know no better honest I didn't and boy when I said that she smacked the side of my face off well, I'm gonna tells you truth that was wrong she should have told me better than that and she didn't had to smack me like that, but I didn't ask her nothing else about Austin no more I guarantee that, cause I didn't want to know nothing about him.

B: How did your mother teach you how to cook? Did your mother teach you how to cook when you were a little girl?

LC: No, my mother didn't teach me how to cook, my mother died when I was just a young girl I only had one kid at that time, but I hadn't learned how to just go out and cook, but uh...I got a job cookin' at company boardin' house and in the South everything is segregated the colored on one side and white on the other one and I got a job cookin' for the Manchester Coal Company and I was runnin' what you call the long table and that was on the white side now the white and colored didn't eat at the same place and they didn't stay at the same boardin' house they had you know everything was segregated I'll just say and I got a job at this boardin' house and uh...they put me to cook the time I got on and got you know used to everything they put me in the kitchen and then I had to come up now if I was gonna hold it and so I just taught myself I got books like that just kept on 'til I got to where that I could cook now I oh, but boy nobody I can cook anything the next could cook, but I had to learn it that's the truth yel I got to where all them forks bragged on me cookin', but I tried hard enough yes I did I practice hard enough, I've worked hard all my life yel, you see I had so many others to try to help up besides myself and took quiet a little bit I had a sister I'm a little bit older than she is, but never made any tried to do nothing I had to help her yeah, she one little girl, she had two, but she lost her baby and then the oldest girl, the oldest girl died when it was little then she had another little girl name Willa Dean, she had Kathaleen and Kathaleen died and then Willa Dean grew to live to great big girl, but she just had two children and I had to take care of them all them I already had I had to care of hers to.

B: You say you learnt how to cook by books, how long did you get to go to school when you were little?

LC: I went to the ninth grade and we lived way out you know in the country like and uh...after you was finished the eighth grade out there you had to go to town to school and I didn't have no way to go and I just had to quit. I went a little in the ninth grade, but I wut'en doin' nothing but wastin' time, because I...you know half the time I had no way to go and I couldn't stay I got place stayin' with some people one time and I got to where mamma wut'en able to pay it and the people wouldn't keep me I just stayed and come home every weekend so I had to quit that and just one thing or another, but since I been grown I went back to school I used to go to George Hatfield down here he used to teach me     we had a lot of fun in school when I was goin' to George Hatfield uh...they was a man there he's around here somewhere now name we call him Mr. Dillant (probably Dillon) boy he'd tickle the whole school he didn't know a A from a H, and uh..."laughing" when Mr. Hatfield have a problem on the board he'd just stare and then look you know and somebody else has worked the problem and when they got it worked and all he'd look down in front of 'em and say that's right say yel, that's right and he didn't even what was right in Adam's house cat and we'd laugh and George Hatfield would get at us about it to he said now he's not to be laughed at don't you all make fun of him said that embarrass him oh, he didn't know whether we was makin' fun of him or what, but everybody must not laughed you know, cause some of 'em knowed cause I know I did, but this here Mr. Dillant he didn't know they around here somewhere now they used to move all up and down and they would move their furniture on the wheel bar and all I know you remember that man if you've been around here much well, they did they never would get a truck and nothing and move like nobody are to they'd have a wheel bar and maybe this one have a mattress on it and the other one have a head of the bed or something else on it "laughing" yeah, and his boy be's by here often I don't they livin' back this way I reckon I don't know, because he's go right by my door and we all were in school together now that's since I been grown I went back to school awhile and this George Hatfield was my teacher.

B: Was that a night school like thing?

LC: Yeah, huh...huh...

B: What kind of work did you do when you first came here did you work for people here?

LC: I used to fix lunches I had already learned how to cook, I learned how to cook in Charleston at the Brown's Hotel I went there and got a job it's on the main street I don't know where it's at it might been gone out of business by now I haven't been employed you know haven't require to ask no questions about it, but I went there and ask for a job I didn't know whether I was gonna get it or not and they hired me time I got there yel, they did they give me a job just time I walked in and I was livin' over here what you call Man, West Virginia at that time, but I just wanted a job doing something I had one of my kids at home with me then and I had to help take care of it some how or another and I went up there and ask for a job, but now when I got the job I moved away from over at Man's and I moved over across there.

B: If you don't mind I want to go back and ask you a question. How did your first husband die? Did he get sick or?

LC: My first husband got drowned yel, he uh...was workin' at a sawmill used to the time that people had these little country sawmills and they'd saw them great...big logs and they'd let 'em off down in the water on a barge and they shipped them logs up and down the water you could just see barges of logs now this is in the South and uh...this my husband had to be down here in front of the them barges they's coming from up here now he had a thing a blocker and when that log rolled off them he had hit that block right quick and the log come off down to fast and it run over him knocked him off in the water and it must have hurt him, because he drowned before we could get him out, that was my first husband and then I stayed uh...single quiet sometime and then I met another something he was a man I know "laughing" well, he was his goodness kind of gain me he was nice to me and he just give me anything and honey he'd draw his little money and wouldn't stop 'til he got home to give it to me, but now he didn't stay with me for a long time and then eventually you know uh...people got to talkin' about and so we just slipped off and got married and they didn't know it for a long time that we was married we was to stubborn to even tell anybody we was "laughing" just let 'em talk.

B: I gonna ask you about some events and then you can tell me what you remember about 'em Okay?

LC: About who?

B: About some events I want to ask you about something? Do you remember the flu epidemic of 19...

LC: The flu?

B: The flu epidemic you would had been about ten years old when that happened right after WW I?

LC: Oh, I heard of it I've heard people talk about it yeah, I know of a lot was sick with the flu.

B: Really.

LC: Huh...huh...but I never did have it if I did I don't remember it really I don't and I was old enough to remember it if I had uh...had it.

B: What did you hear people say about it? Do you remember?

LC: Oh, a lot of 'em they talked about it and how serious it was and all and a lot of people was havin' the flu to, but I don't know what happened we were way back out in the country and I tell you what them ole people knowed more different of home remedies than a little my mamma used to take they'd go out and cut wood just like we burn coal now of course, I don't burn very much coal I burn gas, cause I can't see gettin' out there and gettin' in the cold and all all bugered up and I'm not able to do to much of nothing and I can't use nothing, but this hand fell out the door out the and fractured this shoulder and I can't use that hand and they got this thing all in my breast here now that's hot space and I'm breathin' through that subroadway and it's put there and all the way down and through my back, back there yel and uh...I has to breathe through that tube and I can't use, but one hand what do I look like out there tryin' to get in coal I don't have a soul here to help me do nothing not nothing everything I get done I got give 'em something other a little boy come by here the other day and I was out there rakin' up some grass the man had cut my yard and he piled the grass up in big pile and it had to be put in garbage bag and I didn't have none right then had I had him to do it and this little boy come by and he saw me puttin' the grass in the bags he ran to the steps they's some steps on the corner out there he ran down the steps and he come down and he said now you just hold it open and I'll get it up for you ole he just packin' and strolin' up there the other little boy had both of the little sacks they'd been to the store right up here above he say you better come on here now, he says we gotta go he said wait just a minute I just like a little bit bein' through and he put the little grass in there what I was rakin' up and he said now you come on get your bag said I ain't gonna carry yours and mine to he says well, I got to wait 'til I get my money he little bitty little boy he said I got to wait 'til I get my money I said well, you hired you honey I said I don't know nothing about nobody hire well, he said I thought maybe you might pay me something said give me a coke, cokes 50 & 60 cents "laughing".

B: "Laughing".

LC: I handed him a quarter he took the quarter and looked at it he says well, I did want to get me a coke, but that's alright I just put my hand in my pocket and give him another 25 cent I said now you can get you a coke these children don't do nothing for ya now, unless you pay 'em now, that's all there is to it said I did want to buy me a coke.

B: What kind of home remedies do you remember that people used to use?

LC: What kind of which?

B: Home remedies you said your mother and people back in the country used to use home remedies, do you remember any of 'em?

LC: Oh, yel they had all kinds of home remedies I know my mamma used to go out in the woods and dig some kind of root it was called Sampson Snake Root and she'd wash that root and dry it and you could've had a stomach ache uh...you know something like that or havin' any kind of pain and you just break a little piece of that off and just chew it and swallow the juice off of it and it would ease your stomach off you know any kind of pain right then my mother knowed all kinds of remedies and things like that, but they dig the root of these weeds and that's what they made the medicine out of.

B: Do you remember any others of 'em? Do you remember any?

LC: Any other problem?

B: Hmm! hmm!

LC: Yeah, I know a lot of 'em some of 'em I forgot 'em they used to have uh...a remedy they dug some kind of a root out from the ground it was called uh...Jerusalem or something other like that the name of the it was Jerusalem it was a long yellow root and wherever you saw it at it had little green uh...weed it didn't grow very high, but you could tell it was that then they'd pull that weed up and it had a root to it and sometime they'd dig down in the ground and get the root they broke off down there and they'd dry that root lay it out and wash it off good and lay it out on something where nothing the dogs or nothing couldn't get to it and when it dried they cut it up in little pieces and they had bags little bags something like used to the time we bought flour in uh...cloth bags, I don't know you all never saw none of it I doubt where you did or not even though you get from uh...I believe 24 pound bag sack of flour or uh...either it was the 12 pound sack I believe it was yel, and they would take those little sacks and make little bags and they'd dry them roots and they'd tie 'em up and out in the smoke house or somewhere they just have bags of that little them little roots all hangin' up out you know where nobody wouldn't bother them or put their hands on 'em and they would chew that stuff for most anything and they said it was good, been so long I can't just say well, this is good or not I reckon it was they kept 'em up I know that they wouldn't never let 'em run out they'd always get us so much and put it away this fall and then the next fall they'd add more to it and they just kept a whole lot of it in up in the smoke house, we don't have smoke houses now, we don't have nothing to go in 'em "laughing".

B: No, that's for sure.

LC: We don't have nothing to go in the smoke houses now sometime I look at my frigadare (refrigerator) and ain't nothing in the frigadare [sic] "laughing" well, I don't need, but so much nobody, but me, but I do better than a lot of 'em I tell ya this I don't know whether I told you about it or not. There's a young man come here to my door it been one day this week and today is Saturday which, it ain't been long ago he was along about Tuesday or Wednesday and he was beggin' for enough money to get his baby some milk right young man and uh...I ask him I said ain't you on the Welfare he said yes I am he said, but they don't give me enough milk to do the baby from one time to another and somebody else said uh...said that man just telling you a tale says he can't stay away from right over there said that's the reason the baby don't buy no milk I never open my mouth, cause it wut'en none of my business now that was his baby and he could get what the baby needed to eat over there why that is his business again, but it was pitiful that's true said uh...Welfare give 'em milk, but said don't give 'em enough to last one time to another.

B: Did you ever hear of Booker T. Washington? Who was Booker T. Washington? Do you know?

LC: Yel, I read of him and saw pictures of him and like that you know and we used to have that old time movie I know you've never saw it before and it they showed Booker T. Washington and oh, a lot of these old presidents and all and we used to go and watch him we didn't have movies like we got now bein' here, but we enjoyed that we did we enjoyed it we didn't know nothing else to enjoy, but that.

B: Where did you go see them? Was this when you were?

LC: I lived at home then I call it home, cause I was born and raise there in Russellville they had movies just like they got now do you know they just about to play out ain't they we ain't got many movies now like we used to have.

B: That's true.

LC: They still you know carries it on I think it's one in Weeason now movie I don't go to it much though what little money I get I have to use it for something else you know they got me on a one prescription I ain't talkin' about the others I have to take I've got one prescription that costs me a hundred dollars a month and the Welfare won't pay for a dime of it no sir won't pay for one penny of it yel, I get it the best I can, but I've got a insurance that I took it out in 1952 and I kept it up if I didn't have a pair of socks to put on I kept up that insurance and since I've been sick they really pays off they pay me a little bit every month you know every little bit helps and so I heard that ole sayin' a long time ago and I learned it and it's true.

B: How about Martin Luther King Jr. what do you remember about him?

LC: I was old enough to know all about that yel, I was I wut'en in Alabama at that time I was here and uh...up here at Red Jacket at that time, but I know about it I had been hearin' about Martin Luther King you know in the different schools and all and they was tryin' to immigrate 'em and all and they marched in several different places to where they was segregated and all like that well, uh...you know I knew about it fore I come here and then after I came here well, it just went on and on and on until eventually it just blewed out yel, he lost his life, but he went what he was tryin' to do whole lot more of 'em lost their lives besides him, they blowed up a school and killed a whole lot a children, a lot of colored children in the South they did yel they did.

B: Did you think since you've lived in both places do you think segregation was worse in the South than it was up here? What did you think about?

LC: Well, you see I didn't know about up here at that time I hope it wasn't, cause it was bad enough in the South and I wut'en want it to been any worse "laughing".

B: Was there a Ku-Klux-Klan where you lived in the South in Alabama?

LC: Did we had a Ku-Klux-Klan, yes I'm tellin' you the truth it was pitiful sure they had them Ku-Klux and the colored people got to where it's root-hog-and-die po' they just soon to die po' as to die any other way they got to where they'd get back at 'em honey and they would solid fight 'em, cause I know my daddy was away from me a long time him and a white fellow got into it this man come after him to come. (Talks to someone in the room) throw them pillows off there if you want to just pitch over here, pitch in 'ere on the floor on the rug, now does that feel better? And as I was sayin' my daddy got into it uh...he came to my daddy's house and my daddy was away and my oldest brother not, my oldest one either, but he was older than I, because I got two brothers I got one brother older than I and then he's older than the next brother that was the onlyest boy was at home and my daddy had one these great big ole cross cut saws he sawed the log like that and he told my brother that he wanted his daddy's saw and uh...my brother told him says well, uh...the man's name Kurt Section? and he said well, Mr. Section? said my daddy's not at home, my daddy and mommy either and he says I can't let nothing out of here unlessin' my daddy and mommy says so and at that time had a big wack out on the porch you know and the saw was cross the window up on the porch and when you got ready to get you didn't have to go in the house you just folks didn't have what you call 'em smoke houses or whatever you call 'em you know where you put your junk stuff like you got now he just walked up on the porch and took the saw down and uh...started on off with it and uh...he says uh...don't take says, cause said my daddy might whoop me says he get me by lettin' things out when he's not home and he didn't say nothing he just put the saw up on his shoulder and went on home with it and uh...Johnny told uh...daddy when he come daddy didn't go didn't bother about it that day next day he didn't bring it home and daddy went over 'ere sometime that day and they was out in the woods cuttin' wood and he went out there where he was and he told him says uh...I don't appreciate you going and taking nothing unlessin' I'm at home he said, cause I don't allow the children that foolish to let things out see, because they don't know what they done and uh...he didn't say anything he just grabbed up a stick and went to beatin' him and back in those days if people didn't have hammers and things you know great big ole hammers like that     they cut 'em a big log that trimmed it it down to a handle and left a big ends its called a mole and they'd split 'em a wedge in the log they gonna bust to drive them wedges up and down that log and just bust it wide open and uh...he was beatin' daddy with this big stick and daddy run by the mole and he just reach down and grabbed it up and he hit that man and just knocked his brains out killed him dead with that mole and then "laughing" daddy had to get gone to he done killed the man and then daddy had to get gone and daddy come home and he uh...come home and he had uh...he had an ole shot gun ole it was a brand new shot gun and he was a terrible man to hunt and he uh...got his shot gun all his shells and put his shells over his shoulder and his shot gun on his shoulder and he started across the field and mamma called him and told him said don't go out in the clear like that says you turn and go across the woods and turned then and went from the field where he was into Scople Woods and he went out through them woods and I've never saw my daddy from this day to that one, from that one or this one or whatever you might say.

B: You never heard from him?

LC: No, he left, he left, but he knocked this man's brains out with that big ole...ole mole hit him on the head and he didn't live either knocked him out and he never did gain conscience and just over a little bit of nothing, but uh...daddy claimed that uh...it wasn't just the saw he'd say, but it was how he treated him about the saw said he just went over there to talk to him about the saw, about he didn't allow the children to loan nothing you know, take things out the house and set 'em off unlessin' he was there and daddy just grabbed up a stick and went to beatin' him and he they had these old things you drive a wedge in the log bust it make you a peg like that and put that peg down there and then they had a thing like uh...a hammer it was called a mole people didn't have big hammers and things like they got now, cause I got a great ole biggin' out there back in there where the hot water tank is and uh...he went I guess he was just gonna bluff him with the thing I reckon and he grabbed it up and the man was so close on him and he had to hit or else, so he just hit him and knocked him out "laughing" and he left home and he never did come back.

B: Did people come there lookin' for him? Did people come?

LC: Oh, yeah they'd come there they'd shake the windows and all and act like they was gonna break in and we was scared to death yel, we was we was scared to death my mamma was pitiful and uh...she got up soon one morning and she went way down to another place and these was white people where she went and it was called down on Bellgreen Road and I forget the name of those people lived down there and she went to those people and ask 'em for help told 'em she wanted 'em to make some arrangements to get her away from there by night or early in the morning when everybody would be asleep and this man he planned a way to move her away and they moved her and everything she had to his house and put everything she had up in the barn they had a barn and you could go up the steps up in the loft and they moved her and my mother had six children at home then I had two sisters...me and my sister made two then I had five brothers at home and he moved us all down to this place and I can't think of that man's name I believe they were Wilson's or something like...they was Wilson, but the first names I don't know and uh...he moved us down 'ere and moved us in the barn up stairs and that's where my mamma and all of us children stayed at night and they didn't know we were down there and we stayed there a long time and then when mamma got a chance and he could he got us away from there then, he sent us away from Russellville, Alabama and he got some people to meet her in a place you call uh...what's the name of that place now, Sheriffville got some people to meet her in Sheriffville, now you had to change trains there, because one train went one way and one went another and they wanted her to go out what you call Harrisburg and uh...she had some people out there and some people met her in uh...Sheriffville and they changed and put her on a train and a couple of mens met her there and they carried her and all the children to Harrisburg, Alabama and that's where we stayed she went up there and moved in with her brother and she stayed there and then we you know just drifted from one place to another it's a long story, but she never did see daddy no more I don't know what happened to him he left there and was scared to come back or something, cause he never did come back no he didn't.

B: Did you ever see, you say you knew the Klan was around did they ever come around where you ever lived? Did you ever see the men all dressed up in their hoods and everything was that what the Klan would do?

LC: About what the Klan would do?

B: Is that what the Klan would do? Did the Klan really dress up in white hoods and everything like people say?

LC: No.

B: What would they do?

LC: I tell ya the man that my daddy hit it was crowded them there for awhile at night and they just jet and knock and beat and break the windows open they thought he'd run out or something, but they did not go in they figured if he was still in there he might do something different and they wouldn't go in that house wouldn't come in that house, but they would knock, just knock the windows out and like that and uh...we didn't have nothing but oil lamp and when they'd go to beatin' and knockin' on the house like that my mamma would turn all the lights off well, we didn't have nobody there with us we didn't have nothing she would get the axe and different things like that in the house and she say if they come in the window I'm gonna send one of 'em out if I don't send two of 'em out "laughing" and she had a axe in the house sometimes she'd be hid right by the door you know where if the door was open she'd hit him and knock him back out and we had to good size boys two brothers and boy they was right with us and this man way down another place and he was a white fellow to he came early one morning fore day and he told her to have everything that she personally needed already bundled up and when he got there he drove the wagon just close up to the house as he could they just thowed that stuff on the wagon and uh...they put all they could all the wagon and we got away from there fore day that morning and he moved her stuff all down to the barn, down to his place and this man was name Wilson something other his name well, they had first name and then the last was Wilson and we stayed up in that barn for a long time and then eventually we got away to go home he got some of her people to come and get her and she lived at uh...all my people my mamma's people lived at a little place you call Molden, Molden Alabama and that's where we went oh, that was my first a seein' cotton just as far as you could look just nothing but cotton field just as white as it could be I learned how to pick that stuff to we huddle up and gather ours so we could go pick for different people you know a lot of the white people was well off would pay somebody to come and pick their cotton, but them that didn't have nothing they had to pick their own cotton you know we hurry up and pick our cotton and get through and then we'd go pick and didn't give ya, but a dollar a hundred and honey I'd buy down from sun up to sun down tryin' to make that dollar sometime I'd pick around hundred and twenty-five or hundred and fifty that was good money for a day yel.

B: Is that pounds?

LC: Yel, they didn't pay off every evening they paid off every week you know 'til all the cotton was picked yel.

B: How did you pick it?

LC: You just pull it out with your hand its in a bowl like that kind of something like a roll and you just catch the cotton and do it like that and they had great big ole sacks pinned on ya and they'd reach from here over there to that door and you put that cotton down in that sack and shift the sack like that and make it go down and the next thing you know you had that sack full up to ya just about it and then you they had uh...you know uh...bosses or whatever it was and they'd keep coming and bring you another sack and you had little tags and you pin your tag on that sack, cause that's you cotton and when they weigh it up get so much for it I remember one time I picked I tell you the truth I wore myself out oh, I picked all that week all Saturday and we had to have Saturday at home, because we had to help mamma out some at home and uh...we uh...I picked all that week and I had $30 dollars and I thought I done made a whole lot of money "laughing" home on Sunday and I mean we was in the field at daylight girl and picked 'til sun down every night it get dark before we'd quit mamma didn't do it mamma stayed at home and she kept us fed she cooked and fix this and that and when she cooked dinner she'd always boil enough her son would help out and if it wasn't enough people raise that ole home grown meat then and like that and she'd go in there and she'd always keep something and she would cut off a piece of meat and boil it and maybe put some potatoes in we did something other to help make our part and anyway we ate a plenty and we had plenty of roastneers (corn on the cob) and stuff like that and stuff in the garden and we always had a plenty now, as far as what it was might now have been the best of all, but we had a plenty of it.

B: Did you always vote you know for politics? Did you vote when you were young?

LC: No, I couldn't vote 'til I was a certain age, but I've always voted yel, I don't miss it you didn't vote in the South no way they didn't allow no color people to vote in the South I never voted 'til I come right here to Red Jacket.

B: Really.

LC: Yel, and then they had to teach me yel, but I've been in Red Jacket ever since "32" now.

B: Well, you know a lot of people now days don't know what it was like for blacks in the South, how come you all couldn't vote?

LC: It was what you call it segregated or whatever it is the colored wasn't allowed to vote yel.

B: Did anybody ever try?

LC: You'd better not have tried it, you did you have to wings and get away from there as quick as you could, no that was just that ruddish they didn't allow for colored people to vote in the South, but they vote now, that was what po' ole Martin Luther King died for is colored would have much freedom as the white and he lost his life, but he winned after so long of a time he winned it and that's the reason they have these different days about Martin Luther King now yel, he worked hard you know one while when they was tryin' to get it so the white and colored could go to school together oh, they beat up and killed a lot of colored children in the South the did and the children didn't know what it was all about. I think it was real husband and children because the government let in the colored children. Brutish you know for them to kill up those little girls and all that. They throwed a bomb in the schoolhouse one time and they just blowed up I don't know how many children. They certainly did and the white children all the elder people quit letting their children go school because the gov. Tape cuts off

Matewan Oral History Project Collection